- WLUG - wlug.mailman3.com

Re: [Wlug] Possible intrusion?

by Bill Mills-Curran

Thanks for the suggestion. I'm already using denyhosts, and I've accumulated quite a list of banned hosts as a result. As I noted in an earlier response, I found there was no intrusion -- only a poor memory on my part. I forgot that I logged in from my church's network, and I didn't recognize the DNS entry. So, it was a false alarm. To all who responded: thanks for your attention and suggestions. Bill On Sun, Dec 16, 2012 at 06:56:03PM -0500, Jason Couture wrote: > Date: Sun, 16 Dec 2012 18:56:03 -0500 > From: Jason Couture <plaguethenet(a)gmail.com> > To: Worcester Linux Users Group <wlug(a)mail.wlug.org> > Subject: Re: [Wlug] Possible intrusion? > Reply-To: Worcester Linux Users Group <wlug(a)mail.wlug.org> > Precedence: list > > I'd look into setting up fail2ban, it hasn't failed me yet. (Even if this > wasn't an intrusion, better safe than sorry) > > On Dec 16, 2012 3:59 PM, "David Coutu" <cout(a)alum.wpi.edu> wrote: > > Well Bill, not knowing much about your home network > topology/architecture (routing, firewall, NAT/port-forwarding, ISP, > dynamic DNS etc.), or how you SSH into your Linux box (i.e. through a > public external IP/FQDN or through a private local IP/FQDN) limits how > best to answer this, but I'll make some various assumptions along the > way.... > I'll agree with Theo tho, it's a Comcast address, not an AOL one when > you do a reverse lookup on '24.91.141.172'. *If you run 'last' with a > couple different flags, it will present the IP/host in their entirety > since it will place it in the last column, with either the FQDN of the > IP, or just the IP. > Ex. > #>*last -a * (or 'last -ad' for that matter) > userxx * * pts/0 * * * *Sat Dec 15 20:45 - 21:18 *(00:32) * * > c-24-91-141-172.hsd1.ma.comcast.net > #> last -ai > userxx * * pts/0 * * * *Sat Dec 15 20:45 - 21:18 *(00:32) * * > 24.91.141.172 > If Comcast is your ISP, then there is a topology where this would just > be you, but I'm pretty sure you'd know that it was yourself since it > takes some effort to setup. *You'd have to be doing > NAT'ing/Port-Forwarding on your cable modem or router for the SSH port > to your Linux box, and ssh'ing into your Linux box on that external > address (which would probably get associated with dynamic DNS updates > from the router/modem) from your local net. *Since you were taking that > route, you'd get NAT'd to the router/cable modem's external IP (or a > global NAT IP you have configured to present to the internet for > outbound connections), which would show up in the 'last' output as that > IP/FQDN of that IP. > Are you ssh'ing into your Linux box on it's internal LAN IP or at it's > external public IP? *What IP gets reported back to you when you go to > http://whatismyip.com from the box you ssh into your linux box from? > *Like I said initially, I'm pretty sure you'd know your network and > system set up, and would know if this was actually you are not. > Now all of this is completely moot if your ISP isn't Comcast. *And from > looking at your email headers, I see a few hops of > yours*mills-curran.net (206.130.122.207) &*cheapo.curran > (pool-108-20-153-93.bstnma.fios.verizon.net [108.20.153.93]), which > obviously aren't Comcast. > FWIW, my best practice is to implicitly deny all SSH connections and > explicitly allow only the ones I want in /etc/hosts.allow. *Makes it a > PITA when I'm on a new network for the first time, but it definitely > adds another layer someone has to work around to get in. *If you > block*24.91.141.172 in your hosts.deny, do you get 'refused connect > from*c-24-91-141-172.hsd1.ma.comcast.net (24.91.141.172)' messages in > /var/log/secure (or the Debian equivalent, I think that's what you are > running based on some of the mail headers). > Dave > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Date: Sun, 16 Dec 2012 13:34:06 -0500 > From: iris.gates(a)gmail.com > To: wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > Subject: Re: [Wlug] Possible intrusion? > > Output of last here reports my own static internal IP address. It's a > 192.__._.__ number. > > Output of last on friend's laptop here reports a whole bunch of stuff > (bootups &etc) but no IP address at all. > > Third PC here has custom Debian install, and there is no output for > last.* Whatever package it's in is not installed, I guess. > > We are not wireless. Running through my router, my modem, Charter ISP. > > Liz J > * > > On 12/16/2012 12:16 PM, Theo Van Dinter wrote: > > I'm not sure why you're looking up a 172 IP address. The output is a > host name not an IP.* c-24-91-141-173.hsd1.ma.comcast. net.* Is this > your cable modem? > > _______________________________________________ Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug

Dec. 17, 2012

Re: [Wlug] Possible intrusion?

by Steve Pelland

Did you by chance look at the logs of your router? (If that is logging) can you see an in bound connection to your box? Is there a WAP in the house? Is it secured? WPA2? If so what about those logs? Any unusual machine names on the network toplogy? (meaning is someone squatting on your network and you dont know yet? ) Just ideas. On Sun, Dec 16, 2012 at 1:33 PM, Gregory Boyce <gregory.boyce(a)gmail.com>wrote: > RFC1918 which defines internal ip space doesn't include all of 172.*. > Most of it is public space. > On Dec 16, 2012 1:10 PM, "David P. Connell" <davec99(a)charter.net> wrote: > >> 172.... default Airport wireless address range? >> >> >> >> >> On 12/16/2012 12:16 PM, Theo Van Dinter wrote: >> >> I'm not sure why you're looking up a 172 IP address. The output is a host >> name not an IP. c-24-91-141-173.hsd1.ma.comcast. net. Is this your cable >> modem? >> On Dec 16, 2012 12:09 PM, "Bill Mills-Curran" <bill(a)mills-curran.net> >> wrote: >> >>> I was looking at the output of "last" recently and found several >>> entries like this on my home server: >>> >>> userxx pts/0 c-24-91-141-172. Sun Dec 2 14:57 - 15:09 (00:11) >>> >>> (userxx represents my username) >>> >>> I did a reverse lookup on 172.141.92.24: >>> >>> host 172.141.92.24 >>> 24.92.141.172.in-addr.arpa domain name pointer AC8D5C18.ipt.aol.com. >>> >>> Looks like something from AOL. >>> >>> I got a little freaked, so I changed my password and also blocked that >>> IP in /etc/hosts.deny. >>> >>> I'm not an aol user, but my wife is... but the "last" output shows >>> this as connecting with my username. >>> >>> Any ideas? >>> >>> Thanks, >>> Bill >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Wlug mailing list >>> Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org >>> http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Wlug mailing listWlug@mail.wlug.orghttp://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug >> >> >> >> -- >> David P. Connell >> "Watch where you're going; remember where you've been." >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Wlug mailing list >> Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org >> http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug >> >> > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > -- Gentlemen, *we can* rebuild him. *We have the technology*.

Dec. 17, 2012

Re: [Wlug] Possible intrusion?

by Jason Couture

I'd look into setting up fail2ban, it hasn't failed me yet. (Even if this wasn't an intrusion, better safe than sorry) On Dec 16, 2012 3:59 PM, "David Coutu" <cout(a)alum.wpi.edu> wrote: > Well Bill, not knowing much about your home network > topology/architecture (routing, firewall, NAT/port-forwarding, ISP, dynamic > DNS etc.), or how you SSH into your Linux box (i.e. through a public > external IP/FQDN or through a private local IP/FQDN) limits how best to > answer this, but I'll make some various assumptions along the way.... > > I'll agree with Theo tho, it's a Comcast address, not an AOL one when you > do a reverse lookup on '24.91.141.172'. If you run 'last' with a couple > different flags, it will present the IP/host in their entirety since it > will place it in the last column, with either the FQDN of the IP, or just > the IP. > > Ex. > > #> last -a (or 'last -ad' for that matter) > userxx pts/0 Sat Dec 15 20:45 - 21:18 (00:32) > c-24-91-141-172.hsd1.ma.comcast.net > > #> last -ai > userxx pts/0 Sat Dec 15 20:45 - 21:18 (00:32) 24.91.141.172 > > If Comcast is your ISP, then there is a topology where this would just be > you, but I'm pretty sure you'd know that it was yourself since it takes > some effort to setup. You'd have to be doing NAT'ing/Port-Forwarding on > your cable modem or router for the SSH port to your Linux box, and ssh'ing > into your Linux box on that external address (which would probably get > associated with dynamic DNS updates from the router/modem) from your local > net. Since you were taking that route, you'd get NAT'd to the router/cable > modem's external IP (or a global NAT IP you have configured to present to > the internet for outbound connections), which would show up in the 'last' > output as that IP/FQDN of that IP. > > Are you ssh'ing into your Linux box on it's internal LAN IP or at it's > external public IP? What IP gets reported back to you when you go to > http://whatismyip.com from the box you ssh into your linux box from? > Like I said initially, I'm pretty sure you'd know your network and system > set up, and would know if this was actually you are not. > > Now all of this is completely moot if your ISP isn't Comcast. And from > looking at your email headers, I see a few hops of yours mills-curran.net(206.130.122.207) > & cheapo.curran (pool-108-20-153-93.bstnma.fios.verizon.net[108.20.153.93]), which obviously aren't Comcast. > > FWIW, my best practice is to implicitly deny all SSH connections and > explicitly allow only the ones I want in /etc/hosts.allow. Makes it a PITA > when I'm on a new network for the first time, but it definitely adds > another layer someone has to work around to get in. If you block 24.91.141.172 > in your hosts.deny, do you get 'refused connect from > c-24-91-141-172.hsd1.ma.comcast.net (24.91.141.172)' messages in > /var/log/secure (or the Debian equivalent, I think that's what you are > running based on some of the mail headers). > > Dave > > ------------------------------ > Date: Sun, 16 Dec 2012 13:34:06 -0500 > From: iris.gates(a)gmail.com > To: wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > Subject: Re: [Wlug] Possible intrusion? > > Output of last here reports my own static internal IP address. It's a > 192.__._.__ number. > > Output of last on friend's laptop here reports a whole bunch of stuff > (bootups &etc) but no IP address at all. > > Third PC here has custom Debian install, and there is no output for last. > Whatever package it's in is not installed, I guess. > > We are not wireless. Running through my router, my modem, Charter ISP. > > Liz J > > > On 12/16/2012 12:16 PM, Theo Van Dinter wrote: > > I'm not sure why you're looking up a 172 IP address. The output is a host > name not an IP. c-24-91-141-173.hsd1.ma.comcast. net. Is this your cable > modem? > > > > _______________________________________________ Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > >

Dec. 16, 2012

Re: [Wlug] Possible intrusion?

by David Coutu

Well Bill, not knowing much about your home network topology/architecture (routing, firewall, NAT/port-forwarding, ISP, dynamic DNS etc.), or how you SSH into your Linux box (i.e. through a public external IP/FQDN or through a private local IP/FQDN) limits how best to answer this, but I'll make some various assumptions along the way.... I'll agree with Theo tho, it's a Comcast address, not an AOL one when you do a reverse lookup on '24.91.141.172'. If you run 'last' with a couple different flags, it will present the IP/host in their entirety since it will place it in the last column, with either the FQDN of the IP, or just the IP. Ex. #> last -a (or 'last -ad' for that matter)userxx pts/0 Sat Dec 15 20:45 - 21:18 (00:32) c-24-91-141-172.hsd1.ma.comcast.net #> last -aiuserxx pts/0 Sat Dec 15 20:45 - 21:18 (00:32) 24.91.141.172 If Comcast is your ISP, then there is a topology where this would just be you, but I'm pretty sure you'd know that it was yourself since it takes some effort to setup. You'd have to be doing NAT'ing/Port-Forwarding on your cable modem or router for the SSH port to your Linux box, and ssh'ing into your Linux box on that external address (which would probably get associated with dynamic DNS updates from the router/modem) from your local net. Since you were taking that route, you'd get NAT'd to the router/cable modem's external IP (or a global NAT IP you have configured to present to the internet for outbound connections), which would show up in the 'last' output as that IP/FQDN of that IP. Are you ssh'ing into your Linux box on it's internal LAN IP or at it's external public IP? What IP gets reported back to you when you go to http://whatismyip.com from the box you ssh into your linux box from? Like I said initially, I'm pretty sure you'd know your network and system set up, and would know if this was actually you are not. Now all of this is completely moot if your ISP isn't Comcast. And from looking at your email headers, I see a few hops of yours mills-curran.net (206.130.122.207) & cheapo.curran (pool-108-20-153-93.bstnma.fios.verizon.net [108.20.153.93]), which obviously aren't Comcast. FWIW, my best practice is to implicitly deny all SSH connections and explicitly allow only the ones I want in /etc/hosts.allow. Makes it a PITA when I'm on a new network for the first time, but it definitely adds another layer someone has to work around to get in. If you block 24.91.141.172 in your hosts.deny, do you get 'refused connect from c-24-91-141-172.hsd1.ma.comcast.net (24.91.141.172)' messages in /var/log/secure (or the Debian equivalent, I think that's what you are running based on some of the mail headers). Dave Date: Sun, 16 Dec 2012 13:34:06 -0500 From: iris.gates(a)gmail.com To: wlug(a)mail.wlug.org Subject: Re: [Wlug] Possible intrusion? Output of last here reports my own static internal IP address. It's a 192.__._.__ number. Output of last on friend's laptop here reports a whole bunch of stuff (bootups &etc) but no IP address at all. Third PC here has custom Debian install, and there is no output for last. Whatever package it's in is not installed, I guess. We are not wireless. Running through my router, my modem, Charter ISP. Liz J On 12/16/2012 12:16 PM, Theo Van Dinter wrote: I'm not sure why you're looking up a 172 IP address. The output is a host name not an IP. c-24-91-141-173.hsd1.ma.comcast. net. Is this your cable modem? _______________________________________________ Wlug mailing list Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug

Dec. 16, 2012

Re: [Wlug] Possible intrusion?

by Bill Mills-Curran

That's certainly a good question, and now it makes sense. It was NOT an intrusion. The reason I was sure this was not valid is that I was at church... Now I remember I was working from my laptop from the church network connection before services. This was just me, and the unfamiliar address was my church's modem. What's that saying... Just because they really are out to get you doesn't mean you aren't paranoid. I'm definitely paranoid. :-) Thanks for the help. Bill On Sun, Dec 16, 2012 at 12:16:50PM -0500, Theo Van Dinter wrote: > Date: Sun, 16 Dec 2012 12:16:50 -0500 > From: Theo Van Dinter <felicity(a)kluge.net> > To: Worcester Linux Users Group <wlug(a)mail.wlug.org> > Cc: Worcester Linux Users Group <wlug(a)wlug.org> > Subject: Re: [Wlug] Possible intrusion? > Reply-To: Worcester Linux Users Group <wlug(a)mail.wlug.org> > Precedence: list > > I'm not sure why you're looking up a 172 IP address. The output is a host > name not an IP.* c-24-91-141-173.hsd1.ma.comcast. net.* Is this your cable > modem? > > On Dec 16, 2012 12:09 PM, "Bill Mills-Curran" <bill(a)mills-curran.net> > wrote: > > I was looking at the output of "last" recently and found several > entries like this on my home server: > > userxx *pts/0 * * * *c-24-91-141-172. Sun Dec *2 14:57 - 15:09 (00:11) > > (userxx represents my username) > > I did a reverse lookup on 172.141.92.24: > > host 172.141.92.24 > 24.92.141.172.in-addr.arpa domain name pointer AC8D5C18.ipt.aol.com. > > Looks like something from AOL. > > I got a little freaked, so I changed my password and also blocked that > IP in /etc/hosts.deny. > > I'm not an aol user, but my wife is... *but the "last" output shows > this as connecting with my username. > > Any ideas? > > Thanks, > Bill > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug

Dec. 16, 2012

Re: [Wlug] Possible intrusion?

by E Johnson

Output of last here reports my own static internal IP address. It's a 192.__._.__ number. Output of last on friend's laptop here reports a whole bunch of stuff (bootups &etc) but no IP address at all. Third PC here has custom Debian install, and there is no output for last. Whatever package it's in is not installed, I guess. We are not wireless. Running through my router, my modem, Charter ISP. Liz J > On 12/16/2012 12:16 PM, Theo Van Dinter wrote: > > I'm not sure why you're looking up a 172 IP address. The output is a host > name not an IP. c-24-91-141-173.hsd1.ma.comcast. net. Is this your cable > modem? > >

Dec. 16, 2012

Re: [Wlug] Possible intrusion?

by Gregory Boyce

RFC1918 which defines internal ip space doesn't include all of 172.*. Most of it is public space. On Dec 16, 2012 1:10 PM, "David P. Connell" <davec99(a)charter.net> wrote: > 172.... default Airport wireless address range? > > > > > On 12/16/2012 12:16 PM, Theo Van Dinter wrote: > > I'm not sure why you're looking up a 172 IP address. The output is a host > name not an IP. c-24-91-141-173.hsd1.ma.comcast. net. Is this your cable > modem? > On Dec 16, 2012 12:09 PM, "Bill Mills-Curran" <bill(a)mills-curran.net> > wrote: > >> I was looking at the output of "last" recently and found several >> entries like this on my home server: >> >> userxx pts/0 c-24-91-141-172. Sun Dec 2 14:57 - 15:09 (00:11) >> >> (userxx represents my username) >> >> I did a reverse lookup on 172.141.92.24: >> >> host 172.141.92.24 >> 24.92.141.172.in-addr.arpa domain name pointer AC8D5C18.ipt.aol.com. >> >> Looks like something from AOL. >> >> I got a little freaked, so I changed my password and also blocked that >> IP in /etc/hosts.deny. >> >> I'm not an aol user, but my wife is... but the "last" output shows >> this as connecting with my username. >> >> Any ideas? >> >> Thanks, >> Bill >> _______________________________________________ >> Wlug mailing list >> Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org >> http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug >> > > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing listWlug@mail.wlug.orghttp://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > > > -- > David P. Connell > "Watch where you're going; remember where you've been." > > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > >

Dec. 16, 2012

Re: [Wlug] Possible intrusion?

by David P. Connell

172.... default Airport wireless address range? On 12/16/2012 12:16 PM, Theo Van Dinter wrote: > > I'm not sure why you're looking up a 172 IP address. The output is a > host name not an IP. c-24-91-141-173.hsd1.ma.comcast. net. Is this > your cable modem? > > On Dec 16, 2012 12:09 PM, "Bill Mills-Curran" <bill(a)mills-curran.net > <mailto:bill@mills-curran.net>> wrote: > > I was looking at the output of "last" recently and found several > entries like this on my home server: > > userxx pts/0 c-24-91-141-172. Sun Dec 2 14:57 - 15:09 (00:11) > > (userxx represents my username) > > I did a reverse lookup on 172.141.92.24 <http://172.141.92.24>: > > host 172.141.92.24 > 24.92.141.172 <tel:24.92.141.172>.in-addr.arpa domain name pointer > AC8D5C18.ipt.aol.com <http://AC8D5C18.ipt.aol.com>. > > Looks like something from AOL. > > I got a little freaked, so I changed my password and also blocked that > IP in /etc/hosts.deny. > > I'm not an aol user, but my wife is... but the "last" output shows > this as connecting with my username. > > Any ideas? > > Thanks, > Bill > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org <mailto:Wlug@mail.wlug.org> > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug -- David P. Connell "Watch where you're going; remember where you've been."

Dec. 16, 2012

Re: [Wlug] Possible intrusion?

by Theo Van Dinter

I'm not sure why you're looking up a 172 IP address. The output is a host name not an IP. c-24-91-141-173.hsd1.ma.comcast. net. Is this your cable modem? On Dec 16, 2012 12:09 PM, "Bill Mills-Curran" <bill(a)mills-curran.net> wrote: > I was looking at the output of "last" recently and found several > entries like this on my home server: > > userxx pts/0 c-24-91-141-172. Sun Dec 2 14:57 - 15:09 (00:11) > > (userxx represents my username) > > I did a reverse lookup on 172.141.92.24: > > host 172.141.92.24 > 24.92.141.172.in-addr.arpa domain name pointer AC8D5C18.ipt.aol.com. > > Looks like something from AOL. > > I got a little freaked, so I changed my password and also blocked that > IP in /etc/hosts.deny. > > I'm not an aol user, but my wife is... but the "last" output shows > this as connecting with my username. > > Any ideas? > > Thanks, > Bill > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug >

Dec. 16, 2012

Possible intrusion?

by Bill Mills-Curran

I was looking at the output of "last" recently and found several entries like this on my home server: userxx pts/0 c-24-91-141-172. Sun Dec 2 14:57 - 15:09 (00:11) (userxx represents my username) I did a reverse lookup on 172.141.92.24: host 172.141.92.24 24.92.141.172.in-addr.arpa domain name pointer AC8D5C18.ipt.aol.com. Looks like something from AOL. I got a little freaked, so I changed my password and also blocked that IP in /etc/hosts.deny. I'm not an aol user, but my wife is... but the "last" output shows this as connecting with my username. Any ideas? Thanks, Bill

Dec. 16, 2012

Re: [Wlug] Using Facebook as a Website

by Steven Greenberg

I don't think it is a question of Facebook or a website. Maybe the title of my email gave that impression. We can use both. Use Facebook for what it is good for (if that is anything), and use the web site for what it is good for. Creating events and managing RSVP might be something to leave to Facebook. Although, if we used one of the CMS software systems, it could probably do that job. For instance, I use my personal Facebook site only to have links to my blog articles on my web site. I agree, that I want to own the data on my blog. All my photo albums are on my own website. On the Facebook create group page there is an option to set privacy to: Privacy: Open Anyone can see the group, who's in it, and what members post. Actually, I suppose that may already be the setting. The description does not imply that you do not need to at least login to Facebook to see the group. /Steve -- Steven Greenberg Email: steve(a)ssgreenberg.name 251 Holland Rd. Phone: (774)241-0095 Fiskdale, Massachusetts 01518-1231 Web: www.ssgreenberg.name Other Email: s.greenberg(a)ieee.org ssg(a)alum.mit.edu

Dec. 14, 2012

Re: [Wlug] Using Facebook as a Website

by Tim Keller

While its true I created the FB wlug group, I don't think we should use Facebook... I'd rather we own our data. Plus it would end up excluding too many people. A broader question we should ask is "what do we want the wlug website to be?" One thing that I think we should try to do is start recording talks and putting them up on YouTube and then link to them from the website. I'm all for the wiki, just that we'd want to think about access controls, etc. merely to keep the vandals off. I think this is easy, just force accounts. My .02 dollars. Tim. On Dec 13, 2012, at 3:08 PM, Brett Russ <bruss(a)alum.wpi.edu> wrote: > On Thu, Dec 13, 2012 at 1:30 PM, Clint Moyer <cdmoyer(a)charter.net> wrote: >> Facebook is about as far away from open source as one can get. > > Actually, while you're correct that FB's product is a walled garden, the company itself is a big user of and, more importantly, contributor to OSS. I'd not seen a list, but Google showed me http://developers.facebook.com/opensource/ > -BR > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug

Dec. 13, 2012

Re: [Wlug] Using Facebook as a Website

by Brett Russ

On Thu, Dec 13, 2012 at 1:30 PM, Clint Moyer <cdmoyer(a)charter.net> wrote: > Facebook is about as far away from open source as one can get. > Actually, while you're correct that FB's product is a walled garden, the company itself is a big user of and, more importantly, contributor to OSS. I'd not seen a list, but Google showed me http://developers.facebook.com/opensource/ -BR

Dec. 13, 2012

Re: [Wlug] Using Facebook as a Website

by Clint Moyer

Facebook is about as far away from open source as one can get. On Dec 13, 2012, at 12:31 PM, Keith Wright <kwright(a)keithdiane.us> wrote: >> From: E Johnson <iris.gates(a)gmail.com> >> >> Facebook required me to log in or sign up in order to access the >> page at the link provided. >> >> Using Facebook as the WLUG website would exclude me from having >> access to it. > > As I said at the Wed. meeting, Facebook must die. > > I don't think Facebook would exclude me, because I have > already excluded it. I do think the fact that nobody, except > Chuck, remembered the FB page that is already there, tells > you all you need to know about how useful it is. > > I am happy with the mailing list; I have never used > the web page, though I did look at it a couple of times > just to see that it was there, but if somebody else > wants to maintain other web pages, I have no objection. > > The web is made of pages I never look at. > > It's not a problem. > > -- Keith > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug

Dec. 13, 2012

Re: [Wlug] Using Facebook as a Website

by Brett Russ

On Thu, Dec 13, 2012 at 12:21 PM, Steven Greenberg <steve(a)ssgreenberg.name>wrote: > If the owner of > https://www.facebook.com/groups/worcester.linux.users.group/ > > could open up access to this page so that you do not need > to log in to read it, then this would be a great step forward. > I think the issue is that WLUG's FB presence is not a page at all, but rather a group. If it was a page, then (I believe) it's public by default. -BR

Dec. 13, 2012

Re: [Wlug] Using Facebook as a Website

by Keith Wright

> From: E Johnson <iris.gates(a)gmail.com> > > Facebook required me to log in or sign up in order to access the > page at the link provided. > > Using Facebook as the WLUG website would exclude me from having > access to it. As I said at the Wed. meeting, Facebook must die. I don't think Facebook would exclude me, because I have already excluded it. I do think the fact that nobody, except Chuck, remembered the FB page that is already there, tells you all you need to know about how useful it is. I am happy with the mailing list; I have never used the web page, though I did look at it a couple of times just to see that it was there, but if somebody else wants to maintain other web pages, I have no objection. The web is made of pages I never look at. It's not a problem. -- Keith

Dec. 13, 2012

Re: [Wlug] Using Facebook as a Website

by Steven Greenberg

https://www.facebook.com/SturbridgeForElizabethWarren does not require a login to Facebook. Facebook presents you with a login page, but you can just dismiss the login page to read the original. This is not true of https://www.facebook.com/groups/worcester.linux.users.group/ If the owner of https://www.facebook.com/groups/worcester.linux.users.group/ could open up access to this page so that you do not need to log in to read it, then this would be a great step forward. This facebook page ought to be mentioned on the web site. http://www.wlug.org/. That way, knowledge of the facebook page would not fade into memory in the archive of these emails. /Steve -- Steven Greenberg Email: steve(a)ssgreenberg.name 251 Holland Rd. Phone: (774)241-0095 Fiskdale, Massachusetts 01518-1231 Web: www.ssgreenberg.name Other Email: s.greenberg(a)ieee.org ssg(a)alum.mit.edu

Dec. 13, 2012

Re: [Wlug] Using Facebook as a Website

by E Johnson

Facebook required me to log in or sign up in order to access the page at the link provided. Using Facebook as the WLUG website would exclude me from having access to it. Liz J On 13 December 2012 00:15, Steven Greenberg <steve(a)ssgreenberg.name> wrote: > In the meeting, I also mentioned using Facebook. This is just > about the easiest thing to set up. > > Here is an example Facebook Page that I have created. You > do not need to sign in to Facebook to read it. > > https://www.facebook.com/SturbridgeForElizabethWarren > > /Steve > -- > Steven Greenberg Email: steve(a)ssgreenberg.name > 251 Holland Rd. Phone: (774)241-0095 > Fiskdale, Massachusetts 01518-1231 Web: www.ssgreenberg.name > Other Email: s.greenberg(a)ieee.org ssg(a)alum.mit.edu > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug >

Dec. 13, 2012

Re: [Wlug] Using Facebook as a Website

by Chuck Anderson

On Thu, Dec 13, 2012 at 12:15:27AM -0500, Steven Greenberg wrote: > In the meeting, I also mentioned using Facebook. This is just > about the easiest thing to set up. [quote trimmed for brevity] WLUG already has a Facebook group created by Tim Keller: https://www.facebook.com/groups/worcester.linux.users.group/?fref=ts

Dec. 13, 2012

Re: [Wlug] Setting up a Wiki

by Randall Mason

I just want to make people aware of twiki's drawbacks (but there are way more positives if these don't apply): Page titles have to be ASCII. This makes it tough to include international content. I'm a Peace Corps volunteer in Bulgaria and Twiki was looking to be the solution for a good flexible database. It had support for queries, forms, there was even a SCM backend to store things in. Just no Unicode for page names. It's a little tough if you are working with people with Turkish, Bulgarian, and other ethnic names. Also, it's perl, so cheaper hosting won't always work. It also requires some strange binaries to be accessible like grep and such: http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/TWiki/TWikiSystemRequirements Finally, Twiki had a big falling out with their community and there was some forking that happened. Pretty much "only the original guy" is left at Twiki, and everybody else is at Foswiki: http://foswiki.org/ Foswiki seems to have had some good development past Twiki maybe because most of Twiki's efforts are into a closed source business layer on top of Twiki. The closed source module is amazing looking, if you watch the videos, but it's closed and costly... If you want other cool wiki <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wiki> ideas, you know Wikipedia’s mediawiki <http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/MediaWiki>, you may not know about semantic wiki, built on Wikipedia, but with the data actually machine readable. Very much so the next thing when it comes to wiki. Also, tiddlywiki <http://tiddlywiki.com/> is all in Javascript and you just save the html file when you're done. A very portable wiki suitable for a website and git or just a thumb drive. Also, if you harken back to the days of HyperCard, you may take a look at wagn<http://wagn.org/introduction>, a semantic wiki that the creator of wiki called "one of the freshest contributions to wiki since I coined the term". Another option would be to use what github does: https://github.com/github/gollum. Just keep your files in git and use markdown as a syntax format. This is probably the most "fad" way of wiki these days. Ruby, git, and it survives reddit finding your pages! But really, markdown is becoming the standard for text files that can be readable both in code and compiled into something prettier. Randall Mason clashthebunny(a)gmail.com On Thu, Dec 13, 2012 at 7:06 AM, Steven Greenberg <steve(a)ssgreenberg.name>wrote: > Some mention was made of setting up a Wiki web site. > > I have set up and contributed to Wikis in several companies > where I worked. Those are internal web sites, so I > cannot show examples. > > The software I used was Twiki. > > http://twiki.org/ > > /Steve > > -- > Steven Greenberg Email: steve(a)ssgreenberg.name > 251 Holland Rd. Phone: (774)241-0095 > Fiskdale, Massachusetts 01518-1231 Web: www.ssgreenberg.name > Other Email: s.greenberg(a)ieee.org ssg(a)alum.mit.edu > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug >

Dec. 13, 2012

Re: [Wlug] Need some help with digital signal processing ...

by John Stoffel

David> As a fall-back, I am considering going the Arduino/ZigBee David> route. You can buy ZigBee doorbells, etc. However, this David> requires a fair amount of installation/wiring that needs to be David> done to the house. That was where I was going with my thoughts too. Not that I'm trying to kill your idea, I'm just trying to think how it would work in a reliable manner, since false positives are going to quickly get people ot NOT use your app. David> I lost my hearing during my middle age and I was given a box David> full of signalers by the Commonwealth of Mass. Hooking up these David> signalers is not the easiest of tasks and I was hoping to David> bypass this via having a wearable computer do the David> recognition. (BTW - I have a Cochlear Implant that obviated the David> further need for the signalers). Ouch, not fun! My eyes are terrible, but luckily correctable back to 20/20, though I'm getting old and going to need bifocals sooner or later. Ugh. Maybe instead of having an app which does this, would it be easier to have a small dedicated piece of hardware? When you got the signalers, did you have to wire them all up and run the wires everywhere? Moving to zigbee might be he answer to that side of the problem, though getting the sensors to work reliably is the hardest part I suspect. Good luck! David> On 12/12/2012 03:21 PM, John Stoffel wrote: >> Doing DSP in your phone or other android device might become really >> difficult, really fast. In any case, I'd recommend that you get one >> of those development boards which runs Android and work with that to >> start. No need to sacrifice your phone ahead of time. >> >> Also, instead of listening for sounds, maybe you can wire up a >> dedicated device into the home which would talk directly to the haptic >> device or the glasses? >> >> My brother went to RIT (Rochester Institute of Technology) and they >> have a large deaf population there, to the extent that some dorms are >> fitted out with the bright stobe lights used to wake/alert deaf people >> of fire alarms, etc. >> >> Listening for arbitrary sounds and trying to match them to a library >> of triggers sounds (sorry for the pun) like a very hard problem. Even >> apple is doing Siri by sending your speech to a remote datacenter for >> processing, since the phones don't have enough juice. Admittedly, >> that's a more difficult problem space, but it is similar and less open >> ended than your problem space. >> >> Just hooking an Arduino into my doorbell/phone/other sensors and >> having the arduino talk to the alerting system might be a simpler way >> to do it. >> >> John >> _______________________________________________ >> Wlug mailing list >> Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org >> http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug >> David> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- David> _______________________________________________ David> Wlug mailing list David> Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org David> http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug

Dec. 13, 2012

Re: [Wlug] Need some help with digital signal processing ...

by Randall Mason

The long and short of this is that you need to figure out what the sound looks like. Is it a simple sound that's easy to differentiate by just choosing the highest peak on an FFT? If your doorbell has a peak at 10khz and your dryer has a peak at 5khz, it should be pretty easy to do if 4.9khz < max(fft(audiodata)) < 5.1khz then dryer; if 9.9khz < max(fft(audiodata)) < 10.1khz then doorbell. Most likely it's not going to be that easy. Also there is the possibility that the dryer manufacturer and the doorbell manufacturer used the same component for the buzzer and it's going to be mathematically the same sound pattern, but differ on harmonics blocked by the room. You could need to use the whole fft of the sound, recorded at many different locations in the house and then use nearest neighbor for the convolution of the "new" sound with the old sound and then compared to a database of previous sounds. You would need a large database of example sounds to compare with. Probably at least 100 examples of each sound that would go off and then you would need to set a threshold of "closeness" so that you don't always detect new sounds as one of the old sounds. If this didn't work, then you may have to go with a hefty fingerprint like chromaprint or echoprint. Those would give you so much info about not just the frequencies, but also the rhythm of the sounds. Like maybe your dryer and your oven have the same frequency pattern because the manufacturers used the same buzzer, but they pulse them differently. That's one advantage to these full fingerprint libraries. And somebody else did the science, so you don't need to write a dissertation in DSP to be sure that you have some rigour to your approach. Chromaprint <http://acoustid.org/chromaprint> would be a good library to go with in that case. It's part of the acoustid project and has a great how it works <http://oxygene.sk/2011/01/how-does-chromaprint-work/> blog post for the acoustically curious. The problem would be that it's mainly developed for sounds as complex as music, so I don't know how it would work with a "buzz" noise. It's small enough and fast enough that it can happen quickly enough on a phone. That's how programs like shazam<http://www.shazam.com/>work. They make the fingerprint on the phone from a 10 second recording and push it to a server that processes it. Shazam has riddled the landscape with software patents, so chromaprint isn't a replacement for that, it's just close enough that it may work. Other things to look at: http://code.google.com/p/musicg/ - A java audio DSP library. Does fingerprinting and stuff. Echoprint has been ported to Android: https://github.com/gvsumasl/EchoprintForAndroid If you send me some example sounds, I can look at them in python or something and let you know what I think about different metrics that you could use to compare the sounds. Specifically a recording in a loss-less codec like flac or without compression like wav would be important because MP3 and such destroy parts of the audio waveform. 'Course I could just record my kitchen timer and let you know what it looks like... Your offer to do the programming is great, because I'm no app dev, but I do have some education and experience with signal processing. Randall Mason clashthebunny(a)gmail.com On Thu, Dec 13, 2012 at 4:20 AM, David Glaser <dglaser(a)glaserresearch.net>wrote: > Tim, > > After your feedback and feedback received during the WLUG meeting, it > seems that > it is better to use something like an Arduino instead of a phone as the signal > processing > box. > > To that effect, I googled "arduino dsp" and got a whole lot of hits on DSP > shields for arduino > and on projects that illustrate how to write arduino sketches that > manipulate the stream. > > One possibility would be to have an Arduino with a DSP and a bluetooth > receiver. The bluetooth would communicate with a phone and/or a wearable. > The phone would tell the arduino what sounds to look for - that is, > provide signatures that should be matched. The wearable and/or the phone > would be used to give the event to the user. I think that this > configuration along with a battery could be configured to fit in a small > fanny pack. > > The arduino could also use zig-bee to communicate with a home automation > system and pass events to the phone/wearable. > > Hmmm, I think we are on to something. > > -David > > On 12/12/2012 08:33 PM, Tim Keller wrote: > > I would have to imagine having your phone listen to ambient sound and > then filter looking for a whole range of specific sounds is basically > going to use all the phones processing power along with its ram... > > I have to imagine that not hearing the beep when the oven is done pre > heating must be annoying > > Not hearing the washing machine or the clothes dryer buzz would really > piss me off. > > imagine a box. On this box would be al led screen where you could > cycle through a menu and pick a input to listen to and report when > either that input starts or stops. > > In the case of a clothes dryer when the vibration sensor stops sensing > vibration, chances are good it's done. > > This box would also have plugs for things like a photo sensor you > could stick on the face of your stove right over the led for > preheating the oven. > > All of this stuff could be tied back to your phone that would vibrate > and sent an sms message. Possibly you could tie it in with a home > automation system to flash lights, etc. > > Just some ideas. > > Tim. > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > >

Dec. 13, 2012

Using Facebook as a Website

by Steven Greenberg

In the meeting, I also mentioned using Facebook. This is just about the easiest thing to set up. Here is an example Facebook Page that I have created. You do not need to sign in to Facebook to read it. https://www.facebook.com/SturbridgeForElizabethWarren /Steve -- Steven Greenberg Email: steve(a)ssgreenberg.name 251 Holland Rd. Phone: (774)241-0095 Fiskdale, Massachusetts 01518-1231 Web: www.ssgreenberg.name Other Email: s.greenberg(a)ieee.org ssg(a)alum.mit.edu

Dec. 13, 2012

Setting up a Wiki

by Steven Greenberg

Some mention was made of setting up a Wiki web site. I have set up and contributed to Wikis in several companies where I worked. Those are internal web sites, so I cannot show examples. The software I used was Twiki. http://twiki.org/ /Steve -- Steven Greenberg Email: steve(a)ssgreenberg.name 251 Holland Rd. Phone: (774)241-0095 Fiskdale, Massachusetts 01518-1231 Web: www.ssgreenberg.name Other Email: s.greenberg(a)ieee.org ssg(a)alum.mit.edu

Dec. 13, 2012

Examples of Websites Using Different Techniques

by Steven Greenberg

I have examples of three different techniques that I have used for creating web sites. My personal web site is mostly hand coded HTML and CSS, with some custom Javascript and PHP. The drop down menus are pure HTML and CSS. http://www.ssgreenberg.name/ The politics link on my website takes you to my politics blog that uses Wordpress. http://ssgreenberg.name/PoliticsBlog/ I have my experimental website using Drupal 6. http://www.ssgreenberg.name/Drupal/Drupal/ the last example is the Friends of The Joshua Hyde Public Library on which I have used Drupal 7 http://www.sturbridgelibraryfriends.org/ I did a much more complex web site in Drupal 6 for a Square dance club, but that site is no longer available. I'll be happy to discuss the pros and cons of each technique. /Steve P.S. I have some Javascript which I use often for doing Outlines on web sites in HTML. http://www.ssgreenberg.name/SSGSoftware/OutlinesInHTML/ I also have some Javascript which I use to display all my photo albums on the web. One example is: http://www.ssgreenberg.name/Pictures/2011/10-28-Snow/index.php The software at the bottom of these pages that keep track of and displays the info about how many reads and readers there are for each page was also written by me and uses a MySQL database to keep the data that drives the display of information. -- Steven Greenberg Email: steve(a)ssgreenberg.name 251 Holland Rd. Phone: (774)241-0095 Fiskdale, Massachusetts 01518-1231 Web: www.ssgreenberg.name Other Email: s.greenberg(a)ieee.org ssg(a)alum.mit.edu

Dec. 13, 2012