- WLUG - wlug.mailman3.com

Login successfull on an ftp server, but could not run any command!!

by Aramico

Hi all, I have configured my INternet Gateway using ipchains by implementing the MASQ connection on some defined port in order to enable the internet connection for my client. Finally, I got this bellow message: ftp> ls -l 502 Illegal PORT Command 150 Opening ASCII mode data connection for directory listing. How can it be like that ? Login was successfull, but I permitted nothing to run the command. Can you help me ? Browsing, receiving and sending mail, etc are working fine. Except this one, using ftp. For FTP Setting , this is my ipchains settings : # FTP ipchains -I forward -s 192.168.21.0/24 -d 0/0 20 -j MASQ -p tcp ipchains -I forward -s 192.168.21.0/24 -d 0/0 20 -j MASQ -p udp ipchains -I forward -s 192.168.21.0/24 -d 0/0 21 -j MASQ -p tcp ipchains -I forward -s 192.168.21.0/24 -d 0/0 21 -j MASQ -p udp ipchains -I forward -s 192.168.21.0/24 -d 0/0 69 -j MASQ -p tcp ipchains -I forward -s 192.168.21.0/24 -d 0/0 69 -j MASQ -p udp ipchains -I forward -s 192.168.21.0/24 -d 0/0 115 -j MASQ -p tcp ipchains -I forward -s 192.168.21.0/24 -d 0/0 115 -j MASQ -p udp ipchains -I forward -s 192.168.21.0/24 -d 0/0 2431 -j MASQ -p tcp ipchains -I forward -s 192.168.21.0/24 -d 0/0 2431 -j MASQ -p udp Thanks. Aramico

Nov. 14, 2003

Revolution OS

by swillis＠WPI.EDU

The Worcester Area Student Chapter of the ACM based at WPI will be showing the film "Revolution OS" (www.revolution-os.com) Friday the 21st at 7:30pm in Fuller Auditorium, on the WPI campus. We would like to invite all those in the Worcester Linux Users' Group to join us to watch this film. The film is a documentary about Linux and the whole open-source/free software movement. "REVOLUTION OS features interviews with Linus Torvalds, Richard Stallman, Bruce Perens, Eric Raymond, Brian Behlendorf, Michael Tiemann, Larry Augustin, Frank Hecker, and Rob Malda. To view the trailer or the first eight minutes go to the ifilm website for REVOLUTION OS." The showing is free to all (in more ways than one). There will also be food and drink available for purchase. Recap: What: Revolution OS Where: Fuller Auditorium, WPI campus When: Friday, November 21st 7:30pm Why: Freedom -Steven Willis P.S. All are welcome to come, so let your friends, professors, students, and families know about it.

Nov. 14, 2003

Re: [Wlug] df confused?, just a thought :-)

by doug waud

Hi Chuck Homic wrote: > > Forget it. > > To answer my own question... since it's been around 3 hours since I sent > this message... one of my base packages was out-of-date. (disktools or > something like that, I don't remember) I have no idea why it was > confused, but having the solution, I don't much care anymore. ;) Do you think it could be anything like the way Canadian $ and US $ come out differently? :-) doug

Nov. 14, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Debian to RH 9 Migration

by Karl Hiramoto

I personally would not install RH9 on anything new since Redhat is discontinuing security updates to Redhat 9 in April. Upgrade to some other distro. Guideline: 1. make a backup :) 2. install new distro 3. restore the files that you need. On Fri, 14 Nov 2003, Chuck Noyes wrote: > Has anyone tried this? I don't what version of Debian is currently being > used. > Any guidelines for this kind of migration. > > Thanks, > -Chuck > > -- ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø Karl Hiramoto <karl(a)hiramoto.org> Work: 978-425-2090 ext 25 Cell: 508-517-4819 http://karl.hiramoto.org/ AOL IM ID = KarlH420 Yahoo_IM = karl_hiramoto ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø A man of genius makes no mistakes. His errors are volitional and are the portals of discovery. -- James Joyce, "Ulysses"

Nov. 14, 2003

Debian to RH 9 Migration

by Chuck Noyes

Has anyone tried this? I don't what version of Debian is currently being used. Any guidelines for this kind of migration. Thanks, -Chuck -- Using M2, Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/

Nov. 14, 2003

Re: [Wlug] W.L.U.G. TV show...

by Stephen C. Daukas

I agree. In fact, I made the same point in my first post. What I was trying to suggest was that while the intro stuff was taking place as usual, reference could be made periodically to a configuration taking place in the background. Not syaing how to do it, but that it is being done during the show. The point here is subtle, but powerful... in the time it takes someone to watch the intro show, someone who gets with WLUG/watches other WLUG shows would be able to configure a complete system in a short period of time... Doug Chamberlin wrote: > At 11/13/2003 04:51 PM (Thursday), Stephen C. Daukas wrote: > >> Yes, but I think we might be able to get a bit more in... What you >> describe could be scripted to take less time, depending on the goals... >> We could do the overview in tandem with configuration work taking >> place and "check in" with that progress during the show. After 20 >> minutes or so, show a completely configured running system/server and >> then hit them with "if you want to know more..." >> >> Good? Bad? > > > Generally not a good idea. One basic mistake often made when designing > a new production like this is to try to pack too much into one > session. Similar to a teacher trying to cover too much material in one > class. You generally end up losing everyone - just in different ways > and a different times. > > Better to have one intro show as already described and then a second > show which walks through a complete sample install process. This show > would display the machine's screen as someone talks the viewer through > what he is seeing. > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > > -- Stephen C. Daukas - stephen(a)daukas.com - http://daukas.com/

Nov. 14, 2003

Re: [Wlug] W.L.U.G. TV show...

by Doug Chamberlin

At 11/13/2003 04:51 PM (Thursday), Stephen C. Daukas wrote: >Yes, but I think we might be able to get a bit more in... What you >describe could be scripted to take less time, depending on the goals... >We could do the overview in tandem with configuration work taking place >and "check in" with that progress during the show. After 20 minutes or >so, show a completely configured running system/server and then hit them >with "if you want to know more..." > >Good? Bad? Generally not a good idea. One basic mistake often made when designing a new production like this is to try to pack too much into one session. Similar to a teacher trying to cover too much material in one class. You generally end up losing everyone - just in different ways and a different times. Better to have one intro show as already described and then a second show which walks through a complete sample install process. This show would display the machine's screen as someone talks the viewer through what he is seeing.

Nov. 13, 2003

Re: [Wlug] W.L.U.G. TV show...

by Stephen C. Daukas

Yes, but I think we might be able to get a bit more in... What you describe could be scripted to take less time, depending on the goals... We could do the overview in tandem with configuration work taking place and "check in" with that progress during the show. After 20 minutes or so, show a completely configured running system/server and then hit them with "if you want to know more..." Good? Bad? Keller, Tim wrote: >Then maybe we should go in that direction. Give a five minute explanation >about what linux is and where it came from and then talk about what a >distribution is and the companies that make them. > >Then go on to talk about why you'd want to use linux (stability, resilience >to viruses, breathing life into old hardware, etc.) > >Then take the remaining 15 minutes to show off the interface, mozilla, >evolution, xmms and gnumoney. > >Then finish up with a blurb about WLUG (who, what, where and when). > >Does that sound sensible? > >Tim. > >-----Original Message----- >From: Stephen C. Daukas [mailto:stephen@daukas.com] >Sent: Monday, November 10, 2003 5:40 PM >To: Worcester Linux Users Group >Subject: Re: [Wlug] W.L.U.G. TV show... > > >I have a few thoughts to offer... > >Given the format of Community Access Programming on local cable, you >have 30 minutes. Period. (At least in Shrewsbury.) If my experience >in the past with these productions holds true, you don't have a lot of >time to work with and it is very rare to see a multi part show, even >from long established programming. (Never mind the editing and work >that goes on behind the scences - 30 minutes translates into weeks of work.) > >30 minutes isn't a lot of time. Even a high school class is 47 minutes >these days, and that gets you one topic, say for example, work = force x >distance. There will not be time enough to adress more than once >audience, or more than one simple topic for that matter! > >If you are about to say "but wait, we don't have to limit ourselves to >30 minutes, we can produce what we want" then I would answer, that's >true! But, just as true is my next question - who you gonna show it to >and how? > >So, now that we have established the cart and the horse, we need to make >a few decisions... > >I'm thinking that 30 minutes is just enough time (barely) to show a >"teaser" piece that talks about Linux "the product" and what it can do. >No techno-geek talk (because you will invariable try to cover too much >in too little time), just something that will interest the audience >enough to want more. 30 minutes is just enough time to show everyone >how they can configure a Linux server to support their own real estate >business or construction business or oil business or... as well as >interest the experienced novice who might want to try getting out from >under their ISP. > >When they want more, then you can talk about follow-up episodes, or >direct them to WLUG at the end of the episode (or both). The WLUG site >could have video available, metting topics, and so forth... > >Steve > > > >_______________________________________________ >Wlug mailing list >Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org >http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > >_______________________________________________ >Wlug mailing list >Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org >http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > > > > -- Stephen C. Daukas - stephen(a)daukas.com - http://daukas.com/

Nov. 13, 2003

Re: [Wlug] df confused?

by Chuck Homic

Forget it. To answer my own question... since it's been around 3 hours since I sent this message... one of my base packages was out-of-date. (disktools or something like that, I don't remember) I have no idea why it was confused, but having the solution, I don't much care anymore. ;) On Wed, Nov 12, 2003 at 05:07:58PM -0500, Chuck Homic wrote: > I got this output from df: > > Filesystem 1k-blocks Used Available Use% Mounted on > /dev/hda7 1381 843 468 65% / > /dev/hda1 10 4 6 36% /boot > /dev/hda5 248 1 235 1% /tmp > > df -H produces the not-so-different: > > Filesystem Size Used Avail Use% Mounted on > /dev/hda7 1.4M 866k 477k 65% / > /dev/hda1 10k 3.5k 6.2k 36% /boot > /dev/hda5 254k 14 241k 1% /tmp > > My disk is 8GB, and although I believe the percentages are correct, this > is a little unnerving. Any idea why df would be confused? Or have I > created the most amazing single-floppy distribution ever?!? > > This is a system I just un-mothballed, it's mostly an older debian sid > that I'm slowly upgrading to latest in stages. Could this be something > out of date with respect to something else? > > -Chuck > > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug

Nov. 13, 2003

df confused?

by Chuck Homic

I got this output from df: Filesystem 1k-blocks Used Available Use% Mounted on /dev/hda7 1381 843 468 65% / /dev/hda1 10 4 6 36% /boot /dev/hda5 248 1 235 1% /tmp df -H produces the not-so-different: Filesystem Size Used Avail Use% Mounted on /dev/hda7 1.4M 866k 477k 65% / /dev/hda1 10k 3.5k 6.2k 36% /boot /dev/hda5 254k 14 241k 1% /tmp My disk is 8GB, and although I believe the percentages are correct, this is a little unnerving. Any idea why df would be confused? Or have I created the most amazing single-floppy distribution ever?!? This is a system I just un-mothballed, it's mostly an older debian sid that I'm slowly upgrading to latest in stages. Could this be something out of date with respect to something else? -Chuck

Nov. 12, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Linux Desktop Conference

by Al Reinhart

> I'm wondering if anybody went to the Linux Desktop conference in Tyngsboro > yesterday, and if so, what did you think of it? The NY Times reaction to the conference: I.B.M. Helps Promote Linux By STEVE LOHR I.B.M. and a group of other technology companies are beginning a drive to promote Linux as an alternative to Microsoft's Windows. http://www.nytimes.com/2003/11/11/technology/11blue.html?th

Nov. 12, 2003

RE: [Wlug] W.L.U.G. TV show...

by Keller, Tim

Then maybe we should go in that direction. Give a five minute explanation about what linux is and where it came from and then talk about what a distribution is and the companies that make them. Then go on to talk about why you'd want to use linux (stability, resilience to viruses, breathing life into old hardware, etc.) Then take the remaining 15 minutes to show off the interface, mozilla, evolution, xmms and gnumoney. Then finish up with a blurb about WLUG (who, what, where and when). Does that sound sensible? Tim. -----Original Message----- From: Stephen C. Daukas [mailto:stephen@daukas.com] Sent: Monday, November 10, 2003 5:40 PM To: Worcester Linux Users Group Subject: Re: [Wlug] W.L.U.G. TV show... I have a few thoughts to offer... Given the format of Community Access Programming on local cable, you have 30 minutes. Period. (At least in Shrewsbury.) If my experience in the past with these productions holds true, you don't have a lot of time to work with and it is very rare to see a multi part show, even from long established programming. (Never mind the editing and work that goes on behind the scences - 30 minutes translates into weeks of work.) 30 minutes isn't a lot of time. Even a high school class is 47 minutes these days, and that gets you one topic, say for example, work = force x distance. There will not be time enough to adress more than once audience, or more than one simple topic for that matter! If you are about to say "but wait, we don't have to limit ourselves to 30 minutes, we can produce what we want" then I would answer, that's true! But, just as true is my next question - who you gonna show it to and how? So, now that we have established the cart and the horse, we need to make a few decisions... I'm thinking that 30 minutes is just enough time (barely) to show a "teaser" piece that talks about Linux "the product" and what it can do. No techno-geek talk (because you will invariable try to cover too much in too little time), just something that will interest the audience enough to want more. 30 minutes is just enough time to show everyone how they can configure a Linux server to support their own real estate business or construction business or oil business or... as well as interest the experienced novice who might want to try getting out from under their ISP. When they want more, then you can talk about follow-up episodes, or direct them to WLUG at the end of the episode (or both). The WLUG site could have video available, metting topics, and so forth... Steve _______________________________________________ Wlug mailing list Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug

Nov. 12, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Linux Desktop Conference

by Doug Chamberlin

At 11/11/2003 08:37 AM (Tuesday), you wrote: >I'm wondering if anybody went to the Linux Desktop conference in Tyngsboro >yesterday, and if so, what did you think of it? I went and learned a lot and had a good time. Lots of positive energy and chance to meet people. Minor logistical problems (less than is often seen for a first time event). Too bad it was just one day! Lots of Linux community luminaries were present. Good, thoughtful reflections on the state of Linux, open software, recent industry changes. Also, lots of practitioners who described real world experiences and successes. Bruce Perens says the biggest danger to Linux overall is software patents (but he thinks the SCO situation is almost over and will have no lasting impact on the scene). Next biggest danger is digital rights management efforts of content creators (a la RIAA). Best defense is support of EFF. Bruce says go to www.groklaw.net for a good analysis of the SCO legalities by a para-legal. Several case studies were described of government orgs and schools converting to Linux. An interesting observation was made that these are mainly outside the USA. Several demos showing the status of the Linux desktop as a viable alternative to Windows. Some talks by KDE and Gnome developers on their current work and plans. Bruce Perrins thinks IBM purchase/merger with Novell/Suse is likely. A major observation for me was that, in the cases of migration to Linux, the biggest cost category was "application migration" - not hardware, software, licensing, training, or support. costs. That is big for me since I do contract application development. Would love to help anyone re-implement Windows apps on Linux. Great talk on Linux terminal Server Project (http://www.ltsp.org/) This stuff works. Great way to use older machines but the best were the low cost, no moving parts remote boxes. No local storage but fully functional otherwise. These guys sell them as well as use them. Jill Ratkevic did an amazing job to pull this off. Apparently this is not the last of these gatherings. If you would like to see more of them join & support the Desktop Linux Consortium at http://www.desktoplinux.com/ (membership is $ free). That's all of the top of my head and not nearly a complete report. Doug C.

Nov. 11, 2003

Linux Desktop Conference

by Andy Stewart

HI everybody, I'm wondering if anybody went to the Linux Desktop conference in Tyngsboro yesterday, and if so, what did you think of it? Later, Andy -- Andy Stewart, Founder Worcester Linux Users' Group Worcester, MA USA http://www.wlug.org

Nov. 11, 2003

Re: [Wlug] W.L.U.G. TV show...

by Stephen C. Daukas

I have a few thoughts to offer... Given the format of Community Access Programming on local cable, you have 30 minutes. Period. (At least in Shrewsbury.) If my experience in the past with these productions holds true, you don't have a lot of time to work with and it is very rare to see a multi part show, even from long established programming. (Never mind the editing and work that goes on behind the scences - 30 minutes translates into weeks of work.) 30 minutes isn't a lot of time. Even a high school class is 47 minutes these days, and that gets you one topic, say for example, work = force x distance. There will not be time enough to adress more than once audience, or more than one simple topic for that matter! If you are about to say "but wait, we don't have to limit ourselves to 30 minutes, we can produce what we want" then I would answer, that's true! But, just as true is my next question - who you gonna show it to and how? So, now that we have established the cart and the horse, we need to make a few decisions... I'm thinking that 30 minutes is just enough time (barely) to show a "teaser" piece that talks about Linux "the product" and what it can do. No techno-geek talk (because you will invariable try to cover too much in too little time), just something that will interest the audience enough to want more. 30 minutes is just enough time to show everyone how they can configure a Linux server to support their own real estate business or construction business or oil business or... as well as interest the experienced novice who might want to try getting out from under their ISP. When they want more, then you can talk about follow-up episodes, or direct them to WLUG at the end of the episode (or both). The WLUG site could have video available, metting topics, and so forth... Steve

Nov. 10, 2003

Fwd: Re: Deal for LUG members

by Andy Stewart

---------- Forwarded Message ---------- Subject: Conference update Date: Sat, 08 Nov 2003 15:08:53 -0800 From: Jill Ratkevic <j.ratkevic(a)verizon.net> To: andystewart(a)comcast.net Hi Andy: I wanted to let you know we have had a great turnout on folks who want to come for the reduced rate, but one member was charged the full amount and contacted me. Anyone who entered the discount code of "Jill" in the how did you hear about the conference field WILLl get the reduced rate and I will personally honor that. Late Fri, Xandros agreed to underwrite the rest of the tickets. If this has happened to anyone, it will be fixed first thing Monday morning. On a Saturday I am limited in what I can do to reverse it, but I wanted to be sure you were aware right away of this and that you knew I was personally making sure this was fixed. Best regards, Jill Ratkevic DesktopLinuxConsortium jill(a)desktoplinuxconsortium.org 4008-209-5181 ------------------------------------------------------- -- Andy Stewart, Founder Worcester Linux Users' Group Worcester, MA USA http://www.wlug.org

Nov. 9, 2003

Fwd: Re: Deal for LUG members

by Andy Stewart

---------- Forwarded Message ---------- Subject: Re: Deal for LUG members Date: Fri, 07 Nov 2003 23:42:28 -0800 From: Jill Ratkevic <j.ratkevic(a)verizon.net> To: andystewart(a)comcast.net Hi, the easiest way to do it is to sign up directly. Tell your members to go to: Go to http://www.butrain.com, click on Desktop Linux Conference When they go to pay, in the "where did you hear about the conference box" type in "Jill" They will be charged $25.00. There are about 75 left as of this AM. But I know we have had quite a few inquiries. They are sponsored so I would like to see someone benefit :) cheers, Jill Ratkevic Desktop Linux Conference jill(a)desktoplinuxconsortium.org Andy Stewart wrote: >Hello, > >I am writing to inquire about the "deal for LUG members" who wish to attend >the Boston Desktop Linux conference for $25.00. I have had a couple of >inquiries from the WLUG membership and thought I'd ask. > >Thanks! > >Andy ------------------------------------------------------- -- Andy Stewart, Founder Worcester Linux Users' Group Worcester, MA USA http://www.wlug.org

Nov. 8, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Linux Desktop Conference

by Andy Stewart

On Friday 07 November 2003 11:11 pm, Matt Higgins wrote: > Not sure of the details on this but it could be cool. I think Andy would > have to contact the address on the bottem of the page. > > http://www.newsforge.com/article.pl?sid=03/11/07/1957226 > > -Matt Hi Matt, I've sent a query to the link posted on that page. I'll let you all know if/when I get a reply. Andy -- Andy Stewart, Founder Worcester Linux Users' Group Worcester, MA USA http://www.wlug.org

Nov. 8, 2003

Linux Desktop Conference

by Matt Higgins

Not sure of the details on this but it could be cool. I think Andy would have to contact the address on the bottem of the page. http://www.newsforge.com/article.pl?sid=03/11/07/1957226 -Matt

Nov. 8, 2003

Re: [Wlug] W.L.U.G. TV show...

by Walt Sawyer

I checked with Shrewsbury's studio; all we need is one Shrewsbury resident to be the sponser to use their studio. The resident must fill out a form and they become a member. No costs are involved to be a member. We may have to buy some tapes; they use miniDV for digital recording. Anyone who uses the equipment must get a bit of training. That's not a big deal. Walt On Thu, 2003-11-06 at 10:38, Keller, Tim wrote: > For those who didn't attend the meeting last night, we talked a little about > the idea of producing a linux focused TV Show. From that discussion we > decided that the best thing to-do would be to have the main part of the > discussion through the mail list. > > So, here it is... > > Firstly, I think we need to decide who our target audience is. This morning > I came up with notion that generally, users can be broken into several > groups. > > The first group are novice users. These are people who use a computer, but > the concept of an operating system or the idea that windows isn't just "part > of the system" and not removable is alien. > > The second group is "advanced" users. I think most of us would fall into > this group. We understand OS's, hardware, software and all the digital glue > that holds it together. > > The third group is educational users. These would be people who work in > some education institution and they're interest in linux would be from the > standpoint of deploying it for cost savings and/or using it as an education > tool for teaching. > > The forth group would be corporate suit types. These are the people who > read the trade rags, but don't have a clear understanding of what linux. > They've read lots of conflicting FUD on the subject and aren't sure how > linux could be used in they're environment or what the real TCO would be. > > Personally, I think we should go after groups 1-3. The reason I'm not too > worried about the fourth type is that now that redhat had decided that > they're going to go full force into the enterprise environment, they'll be > busy spending lots of PR dollars convincing the suits. > > What do people think. Also, if it is the consensus that we should focus on > groups 1-3, should we narrow our focus even more? > > Thanks, > Tim. > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > [image] [image] [image] Walt Sawyer wsawyer(a)norfolk-county.com

Nov. 7, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Red Hat vs SuSE....

by Charles R. Anderson

On Thu, Nov 06, 2003 at 06:01:49PM -0500, Josh Huber wrote: > Not to be a pain in the ass, but the envelope information is not > *always* there -- it's not even part of the message. > > Perhaps your mail is stored in an mbox-style mailbox, which uses the > "From<space>" line as the message separators? (I use IMAP as a mail > store, so these lines are not present) For procmail, and perhaps other MTA/MDA-based filtering packages, it is always there, but you are right, it may not be available to e.g. pine filtering etc. depening on the format of the mail store. -- Charles R. Anderson <cra(a)wpi.edu> / http://angus.ind.wpi.edu/~cra/ PGP Key ID: 49BB5886 Fingerprint: EBA3 A106 7C93 FA07 8E15 3AC2 C367 A0F9 49BB 5886

Nov. 7, 2003

Re: [Wlug] W.L.U.G. TV show...

by doug waud

Hi all Keller, Tim wrote: > Firstly, I think we need to decide who our target audience is. This morning > I came up with notion that generally, users can be broken into several > groups. snip, snip > What do people think. Also, if it is the consensus that we should focus on > groups 1-3, should we narrow our focus even more? I have a hard time picturing how you could get something which would be meaningful/interesting for the novice group and not bore the hell out of the advanced group (and visa versa). The closest I can imagine is starting with some introductory stuff in 1+ half hour bytes and then progressing to more advanced topics with the idea that you have brought the novice group up to speed for the more advanced stuff and the experts can skip the early part and drop in later. The problem here is that now you have a lot more work to do. In turn, this makes me think a crawl-before-walk approach is best. Thus I would start with the novice group and, if you don't lose them, plan on going on to the deeper material in round two. I have just been viewing a tape I made of Brian Greene's Elegant Universe (Nova). I could not help watching it from the context of our interest in doing a similar thing for Linux. The Nova show was clearly aimed at the novice. And it worked very well. The general format was about a sentence or two on something with a quick transfer to some eye-catching visual effect ("eye candy"). For instance, jumping now to our topic, one could start out with some catchy "grab 'em" introduction like Narrator: We're going to let you in on a well-kept secret: you don't have to spend a lot of money to get good software for you computer. Followed by a shot of a "user" complaining that he/she is going to have to spend $X to upgrade to WindowsX, another that it will cost $Y to upgrade to OfficeZ and then one of our dorks with "Hey, I can do all that for $30, or even for nothing if I wish! From here you could move to a collage of floating GNU, LINUX, TUX's, Linus, Maddog, Stallman, etc with the narrator saying welcome to the world of what is called open source software, Linux, GNU, penguins saving money and evading the grasp of companies who try to make your their captive audience. etc Slide: Avoid the Gates of Hell, Use Linux! Narrator: Want to learn more? Just jump on board and fasten your seat belt. Take the tour of the world of Open Source! ? Snippet of a Disney world like train heading off to Open Source Land. Narrator; Let's start at the beginning, or actually the beginnings. First we have a guy in Cambridge (back drop changes to Stallman) who got very upset when he ran into computer programs that he could not see inside. It also bothered him that computer programs were not freely exchanged. (Back drop could have some key Stallman quotes on this issue) etc to gnu emacs etc Narrator: This leads into the "second beginning": Narrator: About this time, a young guy in Finland (Torvalds now on the background) was etc etc. snip, snip Narrator: So what exactly is Linux? (Background of floating packages of Redhat, SuSE, Caldera, etc). ---- Linux in the broad sense, GNU/Linux, Linux/GNU distros, snip snip Narrator: So let's take a look at a computer running linux (Background a KDE/Gnome desktop) Here is what you get. Notice that, as you might expect since they are all doing the same thing, it is very similar to various Windows desktops. You have menus, (Background open menu with mouse), you can open applications (Background open something which pops up quickly ), you can read mail (Background --- you've got the picture) you can "surf the web" (Background a good porn site :-)) etc. snip snip Narrator: So how do you get into this wonderful world etc etc. Well, as usual I got carried away but the above does show a few things. Principally, a lot of work would have to be done on getting those background shots since they are the stuff which keeps the audience's attention. Secondly, I found the actual script came fairly easily. The process was essentially to get and idea of flow (This would be a sequence of topics the group agreed flowed well, including nothing spurious and leaving out nothing necessary), picture what graphic (this is video!) would accompany/achieve that, and add the narration to keep the audience on track. Note also that one has to make sure one's internal enthusiasm is translated (and probably amplified along the way) to the screen. For example, if we were to get to the second, for-the-more-expert stage, I would want to see some "Hey this is cool" expletives in the script! At this point, the idea of sitting in a studio with a camera pointed at some "talking head" does not strike me as a good way to go unless you are interested in selling sleeping pills. Time to shut up and see what the rest of you think. doug

Nov. 6, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Red Hat vs SuSE....

by Josh Huber

"Charles R. Anderson" <cra(a)WPI.EDU> writes: > The envelope "From " header is *always* there, and indicates the list > a message came through: > >>From wlug-bounces(a)mail.wlug.org Thu Nov 6 17:27:19 2003 Not to be a pain in the ass, but the envelope information is not *always* there -- it's not even part of the message. Perhaps your mail is stored in an mbox-style mailbox, which uses the "From<space>" line as the message separators? (I use IMAP as a mail store, so these lines are not present) So, back to the original question. If you're filtering on a header, I would also tend to recommend the List-Id header. It seems as though mailman must haved changed the default envelope sender from listname-admin@... to listname-bounces@..., since a copule lists which I had filtering on the Sender header started showing up in my inbox. -- Josh Huber

Nov. 6, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Red Hat vs SuSE....

by Charles R. Anderson

On Thu, Nov 06, 2003 at 05:26:02PM -0500, Andy Stewart wrote: > On Thursday 06 November 2003 5:05 pm, John Stoffel wrote: > > Just a quick suggestion, but could you please re-insert the mail > > header for "Sender:" so it's easy to sort out WLUG email from other > > stuff? > > HI John, > > I see "Sender:" in my mail headers from the list, and it says > "wlug-bounces(a)mail.wlug.org". Am I looking at the right thing? > > For lists, I personally like to filter on "List-Id:" field of the mail header, > but there's probably a zillion ways to accomplish this. The envelope "From " header is *always* there, and indicates the list a message came through: >From wlug-bounces(a)mail.wlug.org Thu Nov 6 17:27:19 2003 -- Charles R. Anderson <cra(a)wpi.edu> / http://angus.ind.wpi.edu/~cra/ PGP Key ID: 49BB5886 Fingerprint: EBA3 A106 7C93 FA07 8E15 3AC2 C367 A0F9 49BB 5886

Nov. 6, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Red Hat vs SuSE....

by Andy Stewart

On Thursday 06 November 2003 5:05 pm, John Stoffel wrote: > Just a quick suggestion, but could you please re-insert the mail > header for "Sender:" so it's easy to sort out WLUG email from other > stuff? HI John, I see "Sender:" in my mail headers from the list, and it says "wlug-bounces(a)mail.wlug.org". Am I looking at the right thing? For lists, I personally like to filter on "List-Id:" field of the mail header, but there's probably a zillion ways to accomplish this. Later, Andy -- Andy Stewart, Founder Worcester Linux Users' Group Worcester, MA USA http://www.wlug.org

Nov. 6, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Red Hat vs SuSE....

by John Stoffel

Just a quick suggestion, but could you please re-insert the mail header for "Sender:" so it's easy to sort out WLUG email from other stuff? Thanks, John John Stoffel - Senior Unix Systems Administrator - Lucent Technologies stoffel(a)lucent.com - http://www.lucent.com - 978-952-7548

Nov. 6, 2003

RE: [Wlug] W.L.U.G. TV show...

by Keller, Tim

I agree with both what you and Matthew both said. So, I think our new groupings should be 1. Novice Users 2. Intermediate Users 3. Advanced Users 4. Educational Users I've dropped the suits off the map because they don't really apply (in this context). I think maybe we should focus on the Novice and Intermediate users first. Then focus on the Educational users second and then maybe due hyper focused treatments for the advanced users. Thanks, Tim. -----Original Message----- From: mlong(a)datalong.com [mailto:mlong@datalong.com] Sent: Thursday, November 06, 2003 10:57 AM To: Worcester Linux Users Group Subject: Re: [Wlug] W.L.U.G. TV show... > The first group are novice users. These are people who use a computer, but > the concept of an operating system or the idea that windows isn't just "part > of the system" and not removable is alien. > I would suggest there is an "intermediate users group. This group is not afraid to play around with different OS's, hardware and software and know how to configure their software of choice. However they rely heavily on configuration tools to apply much of the digital glue to make their systems usable and/or secure. > The second group is "advanced" users. I think most of us would fall into > this group. We understand OS's, hardware, software and all the digital glue > that holds it together. > > The third group is educational users. These would be people who work in > some education institution and they're interest in linux would be from the > standpoint of deploying it for cost savings and/or using it as an education > tool for teaching. > > The forth group would be corporate suit types. These are the people who > read the trade rags, but don't have a clear understanding of what linux. > They've read lots of conflicting FUD on the subject and aren't sure how > linux could be used in they're environment or what the real TCO would be. --mike _______________________________________________ Wlug mailing list Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug

Nov. 6, 2003

RE: [Wlug] W.L.U.G. TV show...

by Simoncini, Matthew

Tim, I would have to say I agree with your "user grouping" for the most part, but feel (IMHO) that there might be a group of people that fall between the novice and advanced users, lets call them the "hobbyist group". These people know how to use a computer, have probably "dabbled" in linux, but need some help performing certain tasks or need convincing on turning the corner and using linux full time. This is an important group because a) I'm a member of this group :o) and b) members of this group know the value of linux, but want to make sure they can do everything they want to do in linux i.e. listen to MP3's, burn CD's, browse the web, be able to use a word processor, etc .... I think that the general idea of spreading the linux word is a great idea especially on a visible medium, but the most value would be added if the largest user group is targeted. So, in a nutshell, I think you guys have a great idea and I hope to watch you guys on TV sometime soon. Matthew > -----Original Message----- > From: Keller, Tim [mailto:Tim.Keller@stratus.com] > Sent: Thursday, November 06, 2003 10:39 AM > To: 'wlug(a)wlug.org' > Subject: [Wlug] W.L.U.G. TV show... > > > For those who didn't attend the meeting last night, we talked > a little about > the idea of producing a linux focused TV Show. From that > discussion we > decided that the best thing to-do would be to have the main > part of the > discussion through the mail list. > > So, here it is... > > Firstly, I think we need to decide who our target audience > is. This morning > I came up with notion that generally, users can be broken into several > groups. > > The first group are novice users. These are people who use a > computer, but > the concept of an operating system or the idea that windows > isn't just "part > of the system" and not removable is alien. > > The second group is "advanced" users. I think most of us > would fall into > this group. We understand OS's, hardware, software and all > the digital glue > that holds it together. > > The third group is educational users. These would be people > who work in > some education institution and they're interest in linux > would be from the > standpoint of deploying it for cost savings and/or using it > as an education > tool for teaching. > > The forth group would be corporate suit types. These are the > people who > read the trade rags, but don't have a clear understanding of > what linux. > They've read lots of conflicting FUD on the subject and > aren't sure how > linux could be used in they're environment or what the real > TCO would be. > > Personally, I think we should go after groups 1-3. The > reason I'm not too > worried about the fourth type is that now that redhat had decided that > they're going to go full force into the enterprise > environment, they'll be > busy spending lots of PR dollars convincing the suits. > > What do people think. Also, if it is the consensus that we > should focus on > groups 1-3, should we narrow our focus even more? > > Thanks, > Tim. > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug >

Nov. 6, 2003

Re: [Wlug] W.L.U.G. TV show...

by mlong＠datalong.com

> The first group are novice users. These are people who use a computer, but > the concept of an operating system or the idea that windows isn't just "part > of the system" and not removable is alien. > I would suggest there is an "intermediate users group. This group is not afraid to play around with different OS's, hardware and software and know how to configure their software of choice. However they rely heavily on configuration tools to apply much of the digital glue to make their systems usable and/or secure. > The second group is "advanced" users. I think most of us would fall into > this group. We understand OS's, hardware, software and all the digital glue > that holds it together. > > The third group is educational users. These would be people who work in > some education institution and they're interest in linux would be from the > standpoint of deploying it for cost savings and/or using it as an education > tool for teaching. > > The forth group would be corporate suit types. These are the people who > read the trade rags, but don't have a clear understanding of what linux. > They've read lots of conflicting FUD on the subject and aren't sure how > linux could be used in they're environment or what the real TCO would be. --mike

Nov. 6, 2003

W.L.U.G. TV show...

by Keller, Tim

For those who didn't attend the meeting last night, we talked a little about the idea of producing a linux focused TV Show. From that discussion we decided that the best thing to-do would be to have the main part of the discussion through the mail list. So, here it is... Firstly, I think we need to decide who our target audience is. This morning I came up with notion that generally, users can be broken into several groups. The first group are novice users. These are people who use a computer, but the concept of an operating system or the idea that windows isn't just "part of the system" and not removable is alien. The second group is "advanced" users. I think most of us would fall into this group. We understand OS's, hardware, software and all the digital glue that holds it together. The third group is educational users. These would be people who work in some education institution and they're interest in linux would be from the standpoint of deploying it for cost savings and/or using it as an education tool for teaching. The forth group would be corporate suit types. These are the people who read the trade rags, but don't have a clear understanding of what linux. They've read lots of conflicting FUD on the subject and aren't sure how linux could be used in they're environment or what the real TCO would be. Personally, I think we should go after groups 1-3. The reason I'm not too worried about the fourth type is that now that redhat had decided that they're going to go full force into the enterprise environment, they'll be busy spending lots of PR dollars convincing the suits. What do people think. Also, if it is the consensus that we should focus on groups 1-3, should we narrow our focus even more? Thanks, Tim.

Nov. 6, 2003

Red Hat vs SuSE....

by Bill Smith

okay. I'm sure that I'm not the only one that has been following the goings-on with respect to Red Hat (dropping the Personal Edition in favor of Fedora) and SuSE (being bought by Novell). I am looking for some honest advice here. I am NOT trying to start a flame war or a distro war. I will honestly take suggestions. I am running Aurora Linux on a Sun SPARCstation 10 (it's based on RH7.3) and RH9 on my laptop (Gateway Solo 9100) right now. I have been running Red Hat on my systems since 5.x. given what I have seen in the news, I think it is time to consider another distro, though. Here are my thoughts so far: I am feeling a bit underwhelmed with what i've been reading about Fedora from RH's website and from Aurora's list. I can't say with any level of certainty that I will stay and shift to Fedora. I will likely shift to another distro, though. I'm not considering Debian at the moment because I don't think that it moves quickly enough to keep up with updated stuff. Perhaps that is a flawed perception, but I don't look kindly on installing a baseline (from the CD) and spending a month of Sundays running apt-get to update everything. The last time i played with SuSE was around 1997 or 1998. I got the SuSE disc from CheapBytes so I could play with it. I liked the tools that it had (YaST was just getting ready to shift to YaST2, i think), but I didn't like the fact that many of the libraries were a couple versions behind what my favorite applications (of the day) wanted to find. I am actually favoring SuSE right now, if I can get what i need on CDs. (Andy, do you have any suggestions?) I cut my eye-teeth on Slackware back when Linux was still at 0.99pl10. My Dad sent me a box of floppies that had everything i'd need to get started. I had a blast! I don't know about Slackware now. I have not been following them (at all) since I shifted to RH all those years ago. Gentoo is not even being considered right now. My fastest system is a P2/400, and that is running Win98se. (My wife uses it to play the Sims. Games are all Win* is good for anyway.) My fastest *nix box is my laptop, and that's a P2/266. I don't have the time nor the resources to (re?)compile everything to suit my system. Given these thoughts, the Debian and Gentoo folk should understand that my opinions, as stated above, are open to change. Show me where i misunderstood, and i will thank you. :) I'm just looking for a Distro that will let me install my system with a minimum of pain, let me tweak where I want, when i want, and provides a neat way to keep things up to date (think security, etc.).... I've gotten used to the RPM system of archives, but I prefer tarballs. I have this "thing" about putting anything I add to the system in /usr/local .... :) Thanks for any advice. Best regards, -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- William Smith wsmith-at-chezsmith-dot-com Fall River, MA http://www.chezsmith.com Bad Joke #2 -- Q: How many Real Men does it take to change a lightbulb? A: None. Real Men aren't afraid of the dark. * TAG! v3.1 *

Nov. 6, 2003

Re: [Wlug] List is back

by Bill Smith

Le Tue, 4 Nov 2003 10:41:59 -0500, « Frank Sweetser <fs(a)WPI.EDU> » a écrit: FS> A few days ago, the mail server for the WLUG list ate it's hard FS> drives. Luckily, none of the WLUG subscriber data was lost. The FS> machine has been rebuilt, and full list service should be restored. FS> If anyone has any problem at all with the list, please let me know FS> and I'll see what I can do. Don't take this the wrong way, but i'm almost glad it was down for a couple days. i was unable to get to my email for a little more than a week. When i finally got to it tonight, i had "only" 460 messages... it would have been quite a bit more than that, had WLUG's list been active.... :) Great work, though, bringing it back! -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- William Smith wsmith-at-chezsmith-dot-com Fall River, MA http://www.chezsmith.com "Art is man's nature: Nature is God's art." -- Philip James Bailey (1816-1902); English poet * TAG! v3.1 *

Nov. 6, 2003

Re: [Wlug] upgrading suse 7.2 to 8.1

by doug waud

Hi Gregory Avedissian wrote: > I'm getting ready to upgrade from SuSE 7.2 to 8.1, and I have a little > confusion and some questions. > > I'm going from 7.2 pro edition to 8.1 personal edition. Any ideas what's > missing in the personal edition? Up to version 7 SuSE used to list this comparison right on the box. Your old 7.2 box should give a reasonably good idea of what the general differnces are. The URL will give the same for 9 http://www.suse.de/en/private/products/suse_linux/i386/packages.html I could not find the equivalent for 8.x :-( > Attempting to replace what is installed, I get a list of conflicts, with > advice to delete the old program, even if they don't have a replacement. > I was surprised to see that balsa and gftp were listed as not having > newer versions. Is this because they're not on the personal edition? I > know they exist, because they're available at rpmfind I am running 8.2 on this notebook I am writing on now and locate comes up with both balsa and gftp (under Yast as uninstalled) so I suspect they are just not on the personal edition. Also the 9.0 URL above explicitly lists both in the professional and neither in the personal edition. > The real issue - > XFree 4.x doesn't seem to want to recognize my ELSA GLoria-L video card. > Sax2 will run in 640x480 only, and I can't get it to run with the glint > driver (the one that's supposed to work with this card). I tried doing > this with the SuSE 8.2 evaluation disk, and I'm running into the same > problems I had when I tried to upgrade to XFree 4.1 about a month ago. > > So here's the question - > Can I upgrade to 8.1 without upgrading XFree? Better yet, if I upgrade > the XFree, and it doesn't work, is there an easy way to return to the > older version by using the CD's. Or do I have to manually back up > /usr/X11R6 and /etc/X11 first, and then recopy them to get back to the > older version? Will the rest of the SuSE 8.1 be pissed off about using > XFree 3.3.6? I am "underwhelmed" by Sax2's ability to get XFree right. I have just been upgrading my desktop to SuSE 8.2 and the screen was all screwed up. I finally went into /etc/X11/XF86Config and found that it seemed to think my 1Meg video memory (I'm the last of the big time spenders!} was 8 Meg. I just put a VideoRam 1024 in the Device section, dd'd a couple of 1280x1024 modes, defaulted to 8bit color depth, and X then ran fine. I believe you always have the choice of running either 4.x or 3.x but confess I forget how you tell the beast which one to use. :-). I would be very suprised if you could not get 4.x to work, but if that really turns out to be the case, let me know and I'll root around and see if I can recall the trick for forcing ti to use 3.x. > I suppose I could change the vid card, but I'd rather not spend any > money, That's my sort of guy! > and since this one is listed as working, I'd like to be able to > get it to work. And, as indicated above, you should be able to. doug PS The WLUG meeting tonight is a good place to get help from real experts, for example, Andy Whatshisname, and others more knowledgable than I.

Nov. 5, 2003

upgrading suse 7.2 to 8.1

by Gregory Avedissian

I'm getting ready to upgrade from SuSE 7.2 to 8.1, and I have a little confusion and some questions. I'm going from 7.2 pro edition to 8.1 personal edition. Any ideas what's missing in the personal edition? Attempting to replace what is installed, I get a list of conflicts, with advice to delete the old program, even if they don't have a replacement. I was surprised to see that balsa and gftp were listed as not having newer versions. Is this because they're not on the personal edition? I know they exist, because they're available at rpmfind. The real issue - XFree 4.x doesn't seem to want to recognize my ELSA GLoria-L video card. Sax2 will run in 640x480 only, and I can't get it to run with the glint driver (the one that's supposed to work with this card). I tried doing this with the SuSE 8.2 evaluation disk, and I'm running into the same problems I had when I tried to upgrade to XFree 4.1 about a month ago. So here's the question - Can I upgrade to 8.1 without upgrading XFree? Better yet, if I upgrade the XFree, and it doesn't work, is there an easy way to return to the older version by using the CD's. Or do I have to manually back up /usr/X11R6 and /etc/X11 first, and then recopy them to get back to the older version? Will the rest of the SuSE 8.1 be pissed off about using XFree 3.3.6? I suppose I could change the vid card, but I'd rather not spend any money, and since this one is listed as working, I'd like to be able to get it to work. Thanks in advance for any suggestions or ideas. Greg

Nov. 5, 2003

Re: [Wlug] REMINDER: WLUG meeting, Wed 7 PM

by Al Reinhart

Andy, I can't make the meeting tonight, but thought you might be interested in the following: Novell to Buy SuSE Linux for $210 Million By STEVE LOHR The deal shows that mainstream software companies are increasingly betting on the free Linux operating system. http://www.nytimes.com/2003/11/05/technology/05linux.html?th Al --------------------------------------------- Al Reinhart Phone: 508.869.6417 DisCom Systems EMail: Reinhart(a)DisCom.com www.DisCom.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy Stewart" <andystewart(a)comcast.net> To: "Worcester Linux User's Group" <wlug(a)wlug.org> Sent: Wednesday, November 05, 2003 12:42 AM Subject: [Wlug] REMINDER: WLUG meeting, Wed 7 PM > > HI Everybody, > > I'm sending this again since I'm not sure if my last attempt made it due to > the mailing list server problem. BTW, my thanks to Frank Sweetser for fixing > this problem! > > There is a WLUG meeting being held on Wednesday, Nov 5th at 7:00 PM in the > Access Grid room on the WPI campus in Worcester, MA USA. Directions to this > room can be found on the website. > > At this meeting, I'd like to talk about the "WLUG TV" show which was discussed > somewhat at the end of our last meeting, and again in the mailing list. I'd > like to see if we can get some roles and responsibilities defined for > interested folks so that this effort can move forward. > > Secondly, I'll bring my laptop and we can explore SuSE 9.0 together, but I > haven't had much chance myself to see all that is new and different. We can > also talk about RedHat's recent announcement about "no more RedHat Linux" and > the potential purchase of SuSE by Novell. > > Afterwards, we'll adjourn to the Boynton Restaurant for pizza and beers. > > See ya later, > > Andy > -- > Andy Stewart, Founder > Worcester Linux Users' Group > Worcester, MA USA > http://www.wlug.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > >

Nov. 5, 2003

One day seminar on Linux for the Desktop

by Doug Chamberlin

I just stumbled upon this and thought members might want to know about it. Seminar is Monday. http://www.butrain.com/itp/desklinux.asp Doug Chamberlin

Nov. 5, 2003

REMINDER: WLUG meeting, Wed 7 PM

by Andy Stewart

HI Everybody, I'm sending this again since I'm not sure if my last attempt made it due to the mailing list server problem. BTW, my thanks to Frank Sweetser for fixing this problem! There is a WLUG meeting being held on Wednesday, Nov 5th at 7:00 PM in the Access Grid room on the WPI campus in Worcester, MA USA. Directions to this room can be found on the website. At this meeting, I'd like to talk about the "WLUG TV" show which was discussed somewhat at the end of our last meeting, and again in the mailing list. I'd like to see if we can get some roles and responsibilities defined for interested folks so that this effort can move forward. Secondly, I'll bring my laptop and we can explore SuSE 9.0 together, but I haven't had much chance myself to see all that is new and different. We can also talk about RedHat's recent announcement about "no more RedHat Linux" and the potential purchase of SuSE by Novell. Afterwards, we'll adjourn to the Boynton Restaurant for pizza and beers. See ya later, Andy -- Andy Stewart, Founder Worcester Linux Users' Group Worcester, MA USA http://www.wlug.org

Nov. 5, 2003

Re: [Wlug] system time config question

by Bill Mills-Curran

On Tue, 4 Nov 2003, Theo Van Dinter wrote: TVD> Date: Tue, 4 Nov 2003 10:56:50 -0500 TVD> TVD> On Tue, Nov 04, 2003 at 10:54:04AM -0500, Bill Mills-Curran wrote: TVD> > check the reference network time (daily?) to correct the local system TVD> > time. TVD> > TVD> > I've compared a number of things between systems to try to identify TVD> > what's wrong on the one machine, but I haven't found the key yet. TVD> > TVD> > Any suggestions? TVD> TVD> Are you running ntpd? It'll keep the time updated for you all the time. Theo, Weird.... Well, I _thought_ I was... But, now, when I looked, I found that it crashed a few days ago. I restarted it, and I'll keep and eye on it. Very strange. Thanks, Bill

Nov. 4, 2003

Re: [Wlug] system time config question

by Theo Van Dinter

On Tue, Nov 04, 2003 at 10:54:04AM -0500, Bill Mills-Curran wrote: > check the reference network time (daily?) to correct the local system > time. > > I've compared a number of things between systems to try to identify > what's wrong on the one machine, but I haven't found the key yet. > > Any suggestions? Are you running ntpd? It'll keep the time updated for you all the time. -- Randomly Generated Tagline: "It can be done better, it should be done better. But it won't be unless we complain about it." - Steve Simmons in <20020923152416.GA28800(a)lokkur.dexter.mi.us>

Nov. 4, 2003

system time config question

by Bill Mills-Curran

This is a repost -- I believe the original was lost during the WLUG server outage. I'm having trouble keeping the time correct on one of my linux boxes. Just one of them. My others are just fine. In all cases, I'm using the redhat-config-date gui. When I use the gui, it corrects the time just fine, but somethings not happening to check the reference network time (daily?) to correct the local system time. I've compared a number of things between systems to try to identify what's wrong on the one machine, but I haven't found the key yet. Any suggestions? TIA, Bill

Nov. 4, 2003

Re: [Wlug] List is back

by Bill Mills-Curran

Frank, Thanks for resurrecting things. Bill On Tue, 4 Nov 2003, Frank Sweetser wrote: FS> Date: Tue, 4 Nov 2003 10:41:59 -0500 FS> From: Frank Sweetser <fs(a)WPI.EDU> FS> Reply-To: Worcester Linux Users Group <wlug(a)mail.wlug.org> FS> To: wlug(a)wlug.org FS> Subject: [Wlug] List is back FS> FS> A few days ago, the mail server for the WLUG list ate it's hard drives. FS> Luckily, none of the WLUG subscriber data was lost. The machine has been FS> rebuilt, and full list service should be restored. If anyone has any problem FS> at all with the list, please let me know and I'll see what I can do. FS> FS> -- FS> Frank Sweetser fs at wpi.edu FS> WPI Network Engineer FS> FS> _______________________________________________ FS> Wlug mailing list FS> Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org FS> http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug FS>

Nov. 4, 2003

List is back

by Frank Sweetser

A few days ago, the mail server for the WLUG list ate it's hard drives. Luckily, none of the WLUG subscriber data was lost. The machine has been rebuilt, and full list service should be restored. If anyone has any problem at all with the list, please let me know and I'll see what I can do. -- Frank Sweetser fs at wpi.edu WPI Network Engineer

Nov. 4, 2003

List is back

by Frank Sweetser

A few days ago, the mail server for the WLUG list ate it's hard drives. Luckily, none of the WLUG subscriber data was lost. The machine has been rebuilt, and full list service should be restored. If anyone has any problem at all with the list, please let me know and I'll see what I can do. -- Frank Sweetser fs at wpi.edu WPI Network Engineer

Nov. 4, 2003

List is back

by Frank Sweetser

A few days ago, the mail server for the WLUG list ate it's hard drives. Luckily, none of the WLUG subscriber data was lost. The machine has been rebuilt, and full list service should be restored. If anyone has any problem at all with the list, please let me know and I'll see what I can do. -- Frank Sweetser fs at wpi.edu WPI Network Engineer

Nov. 4, 2003

List is back

by Frank Sweetser

A few days ago, the mail server for the WLUG list ate it's hard drives. Luckily, none of the WLUG subscriber data was lost. The machine has been rebuilt, and full list service should be restored. If anyone has any problem at all with the list, please let me know and I'll see what I can do. -- Frank Sweetser fs at wpi.edu WPI Network Engineer

Nov. 4, 2003

Redhat EOL

by Karl Hiramoto

Red Hat will discontinue maintenance and errata support for Red Hat Linux 9 as of April 30, 2004. Red Hat does not plan to release another product in the Red Hat Linux line. So what distro is everyone going to switch to? -- ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø Karl Hiramoto <karl(a)hiramoto.org> Work: 978-425-2090 ext 25 Cell: 508-517-4819 http://karl.hiramoto.org/ AOL IM ID = KarlH420 Yahoo_IM = karl_hiramoto ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø In the Spring, I have counted 136 different kinds of weather inside of 24 hours. -- Mark Twain, on New England weather

Nov. 3, 2003

REMINDER: Meeting Wed Nov 5 @ 7PM

by Andy Stewart

Hi Everybody, We have a WLUG meeting coming up this Wednesday, November 5th, at 7:00 PM in the Access Grid room on the WPI campus. Please check the WLUG website for directions to this location. At this meeting, I'd like to take a few minutes to discuss the "WLUG TV" show that was proposed at the last meeting, and which seems to have considerable interest from quite a few people in WLUG. We are fortunate that we have people in WLUG who have experience in this area, and that we have folks who have the energy and desire to do this type of work. I would like to identify those people who definitely wish to participate, and perhaps a project leader. In a few minutes, I'm going to start installing SuSE Linux 9.0 on my laptop. If I get it working, and can learn enough about its distinguishing features, I'll discuss that at the meeting also. If I hit problems, or if I don't have enough time to play with it, I'll defer this topic to the December meeting. To be completely fair, if somebody wants to address a WLUG meeting to discuss the latest features of their favorite distribution, please let me know, and we can arrange this. For example, I'm curious to know more about Gentoo, or how to install Knoppix on my hard drive, or why Debian's "apt-get" is supposedly better than rpms. If people have some quick 5-15 minute topics for this meeting, bring them along and we can discuss them as a group. Tech support types of questions are always welcome, as are new user questions. If you are bashful, send me the question and I'll ask it at the meeting. :-) Later, Andy -- Andy Stewart, Founder Worcester Linux Users' Group Worcester, MA USA http://www.wlug.org

Nov. 2, 2003

system time config question

by Bill Mills-Curran

I'm having trouble keeping the time correct on one of my linux boxes. Just one of them. My others are just fine. In all cases, I'm using the redhat-config-date gui. When I use the gui, it corrects the time just fine, but somethings not happening to check the reference network time (daily?) to correct the local system time. I've compared a number of things between systems to try to identify what's wrong on the one machine, but I haven't found the key yet. Any suggestions? TIA, Bill

Oct. 31, 2003

Echo...

by Keller, Tim

I sent a piece of mail on Tuesday and I never saw it reappear in my inbox. However, when you check the archive it's there. Are we having a list problem??? Tim.

Oct. 30, 2003

Status of the Show?

by Keller, Tim

Due to a midterm, I wasn't able to make it out to Shrewsbury to the tv studio. What came of the meeting out there? Thanks, Tim.

Oct. 28, 2003

Scheduling software

by mlong＠datalong.com

Hi, I am working with a Director of Parks and Recreation Dept here in MA to automate their office. The first piece to be tackled is the scheduling of the town ball fields. Does anyone know of any open source projects that can do this? Thanks, Mike

Oct. 27, 2003

open source and massachusetts

by doug waud

Hi all I was somewhat surprised not to see mention of this article on this list so I thought I'd pass it on. On Monday the T&G had an article "Tech Policy Changes --- Mass going open source". The gist was that Finance secretary, Erik Kriss instructed the state's chief technology officer to adopt a policy of "open standards, open source" for all future spending on information technology. Interesting. It will be interesting to see what comes of this. doug

Oct. 23, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Fw: RE: show

by doug waud

doug waud wrote: > Hi all > I have been lurking and on the horns of a dilema. Snip, snip > Since the "event" is right here is Shrewsbury, I'll probably show up To compound that bad metaphor, a third horn has appeared, I just realizd that today is my birthday and my wife is taking me out to dinner. All those of you who are married will know that horn trumps the other two! So, you'll have to get on without me :-( :-) Sorry, I'll try, probably unsuccessfully, to avoid another such "senior moment" in the future. doug

Oct. 21, 2003

Fw: Fw: RE: show

by Yury I Vashugin

thanks everyone! you're right there! i've scheduled a meeting in the production room with people who are interested in making the show to discuss the details(see below). with everyone's responces so far i don't think it's quite possible to even meet for a production discussion. i've canceled the show time(production meeting) for tomorrow due to the lack of people . however i'll be there anyway......... as far as editing - it should be a 'live' show as previosly mentioned(that's where a good show host will be in need). if anyone wants to spent hours editing footage it would not be me. yury ps al, mattew thank you for your desire to participate in the project. i greatly appreciate your responce. Hi! Since my job is in the TV field, I have been watching this thread. Before you can even look at a studio, there are several things that need to be acomplished. The Producer (someone has to take the reins and make decisions, studio reservations, find crew, etc.) needs to set up some production meetings and decide how the show will be formatted (is it a series of shows, is it a one time show, talking heads show, magazine type, etc.). Then, a script has to be written. What will happen when, what needs to be edited, how long the final production will be, etc. Then a crew has to be chosen: director, camera operators, editors, etc. Then studio time, if needed, could be reserved. If someone has a digital video camera, I believe there is some editing software out there that runs on Linux. Doug, you are right, but your numbers are off a tad; for every second of finished video, approx. 1 minute of post production are required. Pre-production time is even more than that, sometimes. Don't let the numbers scare you...it's still quite do-able, just remember, a good product takes some time and work. Walt On Sat, 2003-10-18 at 20:08, doug waud wrote: I have been lurking and on the horns of a dilema. The above comments got me off the fence. (On re-reading, that is an atrocious mixed metaphor --- natural talent!) :-) Then general idea of proseletizing strikes me as reasonable. However, I think it is a good idea to do as good a job as possible. Although I admit to little direct experience with such exercises, my impression is that they should not be lightly undertaken. In particular, I gather it takes about ten hours preparation for one hour of finished product (and that ratio is probabley optimistic). You have to identify your audience, identify, rank and organize what topics should be covered, decide on how best to utilize the time, write some sort of at least a detailed outline, if not a full script, try dry run(s). etc. So far, all I see is the idea that a group of well-meaning people are supposed to show up and "wing it". Sounds like a disaster waiting to happen. The discussion at the end of the last WLUG meeting demonstrated little more that that there were about as many views as to how to proceed as there were people in the discussion. Lots of chiefs, no indians. Now I readily confess that I am very good at spotting the negative side of just about anything. :-) (On a plane ride from Florida to Philadelphia, I once convinved a pharmacological colleague that an idea he was exploring made no sense at all. Years later, when Julie Axelrod got the Nobel prize for that general concept, I had one of those "oh shit" moments. Fortunately for me, the guy from Philadelphia, it turned out, had dropped the issue, but not on the basis of my comments.) The other horn of my dilema, is that I would like to help, but don't want to appear and just be a wet blanket. Since the "event" is right here is Shrewsbury, I'll probably show up (since I can at least function as a "gofer", pull out power cords and the like) but try to maintain a low profile. doug --------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Yury I Vashugin <vashugins(a)juno.com> To: wlug(a)mail.wlug.org Cc: wlug(a)wlug.org Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2003 12:55:39 -0400 Subject: Fw: RE: show hi, everyone. since we talked about producing an educational show about linux and putting it 'in-the-air' at the last wlug meeting and i saw a very enthusiastic response so i've reserved the studio for oct.21(see below). there's a problem with a converter but i'm sure we can find a laptop with a video output. for the show we need two cameramen(anyone can do that; very simple duties and can be learned within 3-5 min), a show host and guests. please, bring any suggestions or/and recommendations. thanks. yury --------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Marc Serra <mserra(a)ci.shrewsbury.ma.us> To: 'Yury I Vashugin' <vashugins(a)juno.com> Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2003 13:42:56 -0400 Subject: RE: show Message-ID: <A7F72312FF5DB348BE2D037A6FE5F1C1407EC2@selpnt2> Yes. Does anybody in the group have access to a scan converter or can you use a computer with a video card output? Since we spoke about it, our last scan converter was put into service to be used on one of our channel's for our bulletin board. For you to use it, we would have to take a channel off the air. I know that a lot of laptops have video out. -----Original Message----- From: Yury I Vashugin [mailto:vashugins@juno.com] Sent: Friday, October 10, 2003 11:48 AM To: mserra(a)ci.shrewsbury.ma.us Subject: show marc, can i reserve the studio for half-an-hour show on tuesday, october 21 at 6:30 (actually it will not be a show; just a preliminary stuff- what light, what background, what settings we want for 'linux show', to try a scanner converter etc)? yury

Oct. 20, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Fw: RE: show

by Walt Sawyer

Hi! Since my job is in the TV field, I have been watching this thread. Before you can even look at a studio, there are several things that need to be acomplished. The Producer (someone has to take the reins and make decisions, studio reservations, find crew, etc.) needs to set up some production meetings and decide how the show will be formatted (is it a series of shows, is it a one time show, talking heads show, magazine type, etc.). Then, a script has to be written. What will happen when, what needs to be edited, how long the final production will be, etc. Then a crew has to be chosen: director, camera operators, editors, etc. Then studio time, if needed, could be reserved. If someone has a digital video camera, I believe there is some editing software out there that runs on Linux. Doug, you are right, but your numbers are off a tad; for every second of finished video, approx. 1 minute of post production are required. Pre-production time is even more than that, sometimes. Don't let the numbers scare you...it's still quite do-able, just remember, a good product takes some time and work. Walt On Sat, 2003-10-18 at 20:08, doug waud wrote: > Hi all > > Yury I Vashugin wrote: > > > first, we need people to produce the show. it's a commitment of half an > > hour ones? a month.(could be ones in two months) is there anyone who > > would like to join the venture? > > I have been lurking and on the horns of a dilema. The above comments got > me off the fence. (On re-reading, that is an atrocious mixed metaphor > --- natural talent!) :-) > > Then general idea of proseletizing strikes me as reasonable. However, I > think it is a good idea to do as good a job as possible. Although I > admit to little direct experience with such exercises, my impression is > that they should not be lightly undertaken. In particular, I gather it > takes about ten hours preparation for one hour of finished product (and > that ratio is probabley optimistic). You have to identify your audience, > identify, rank and organize what topics should be covered, decide on how > best to utilize the time, write some sort of at least a detailed > outline, if not a full script, try dry run(s). etc. > > So far, all I see is the idea that a group of well-meaning people are > supposed to show up and "wing it". Sounds like a disaster waiting to > happen. The discussion at the end of the last WLUG meeting demonstrated > little more that that there were about as many views as to how to > proceed as there were people in the discussion. Lots of chiefs, no indians. > > Now I readily confess that I am very good at spotting the negative side > of just about anything. :-) (On a plane ride from Florida to > Philadelphia, I once convinved a pharmacological colleague that an idea > he was exploring made no sense at all. Years later, when Julie Axelrod > got the Nobel prize for that general concept, I had one of those "oh > shit" moments. Fortunately for me, the guy from Philadelphia, it turned > out, had dropped the issue, but not on the basis of my comments.) > > The other horn of my dilema, is that I would like to help, but don't > want to appear and just be a wet blanket. > > Since the "event" is right here is Shrewsbury, I'll probably show up > (since I can at least function as a "gofer", pull out power cords and > the like) but try to maintain a low profile. > > doug > > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > >

Oct. 20, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Fw: RE: show

by doug waud

Hi all Yury I Vashugin wrote: > first, we need people to produce the show. it's a commitment of half an > hour ones? a month.(could be ones in two months) is there anyone who > would like to join the venture? I have been lurking and on the horns of a dilema. The above comments got me off the fence. (On re-reading, that is an atrocious mixed metaphor --- natural talent!) :-) Then general idea of proseletizing strikes me as reasonable. However, I think it is a good idea to do as good a job as possible. Although I admit to little direct experience with such exercises, my impression is that they should not be lightly undertaken. In particular, I gather it takes about ten hours preparation for one hour of finished product (and that ratio is probabley optimistic). You have to identify your audience, identify, rank and organize what topics should be covered, decide on how best to utilize the time, write some sort of at least a detailed outline, if not a full script, try dry run(s). etc. So far, all I see is the idea that a group of well-meaning people are supposed to show up and "wing it". Sounds like a disaster waiting to happen. The discussion at the end of the last WLUG meeting demonstrated little more that that there were about as many views as to how to proceed as there were people in the discussion. Lots of chiefs, no indians. Now I readily confess that I am very good at spotting the negative side of just about anything. :-) (On a plane ride from Florida to Philadelphia, I once convinved a pharmacological colleague that an idea he was exploring made no sense at all. Years later, when Julie Axelrod got the Nobel prize for that general concept, I had one of those "oh shit" moments. Fortunately for me, the guy from Philadelphia, it turned out, had dropped the issue, but not on the basis of my comments.) The other horn of my dilema, is that I would like to help, but don't want to appear and just be a wet blanket. Since the "event" is right here is Shrewsbury, I'll probably show up (since I can at least function as a "gofer", pull out power cords and the like) but try to maintain a low profile. doug

Oct. 19, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Fw: RE: show

by Yury I Vashugin

matthew, if we're doing it i'll give you a ride..... yury On Wed, 15 Oct 2003 21:05:43 -0400 Matthew Kwiatkowski <mskwik(a)WPI.EDU> writes: > I think this sounds like it's turning into an interesting idea. I > would > be willing to help out as a cameraman or something behind the > scenes, > and I do have a laptop with video out, but I would need a ride from > campus to the studio. I will also be home on break the week of the > 21st, so I can't make that night. > > -Matthew Kwiatkowski > > On Wed, 2003-10-15 at 13:39, Yury I Vashugin wrote: > > tim, > > it seems like we don't have enough people to run the show. maybe > > different date and time would be more appropriate for > people(depending, > > of course, on the studio availability)... > > first, we need people to produce the show. it's a commitment of > half an > > hour ones? a month.(could be ones in two months) is there anyone > who > > would like to join the venture? > > second, we need a qualified show host who will lead the show and > > interview guests. i'm a new to linux and i would not dare to > discuss it > > with my expertize. > > third, there is little problem with scan converter which can be > replaced > > by a notebook with a video output. > > a tape of the show will be available immediately after the show > and can > > be broadcast on any channel(depending on the amount of money, > sponsorship > > etc; public access channels are free). also it's a good learning > tool > > which can be multiplied and offered to the public. i still > remember a > > hot discussion on wlug about introducing linux in public schools. > i was > > astonished to see how college students buy c compilers for windows > to do > > their homework for unix/c class. isn't it something? > > they know about linux but, o boy, they're scared of it!!!(wow, > wow- i'm > > not talking about wpi students) > > good point was brought by goug. we need to know what audience we > are > > going to target and where. if we start the show with linux > introduction > > and discuss the difference between linux and commonly used > operating > > systems, to get people intrigued, and continuously refer people to > 'that > > show' then they'll know the connection, how to obtain previous > > educational tapes etc. > > yury > > ps keep forgeting to indicate the studio location- shewsbury > media > > connection, parker rd. > > > > > > On Wed, 15 Oct 2003 00:40:51 -0400 Andy Stewart > <andystewart(a)comcast.net> > > writes: > > > On Tuesday 14 October 2003 12:55 pm, Yury I Vashugin wrote: > > > > hi, everyone. > > > > since we talked about producing an educational show about > linux > > > and > > > > putting it 'in-the-air' at the last wlug meeting and i saw a > very > > > > enthusiastic response so i've reserved the studio for > oct.21(see > > > below). > > > > there's a problem with a converter but i'm sure we can find a > > > > laptop with > > > > a video output. > > > > > > HI everybody, > > > > > > I'm still quite enthusiastic about this opportunity, but > > > unfortunately I > > > cannot make it on October 21st (Tuesday is generally a bad night > for > > > me). I > > > will be looking forward to reading the e-mails from people who > do > > > make it on > > > that date. > > > > > > Please keep us posted! > > > > > > Andy > > > > > > -- > > > Andy Stewart, Founder > > > Worcester Linux Users' Group > > > Worcester, MA USA > > > http://www.wlug.org > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Wlug mailing list > > > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > > > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________ > > The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! > > Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! > > Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wlug mailing list > > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > > ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today!

Oct. 17, 2003

RE: [Wlug] domain settings on dsl with dynamic IP and NAT (and postfix issue)

by Jim & Toni

Again, more investigation and I found the problem. Need to set the root: alias to a non-root user in the aliases file. Postfix won't deliver mail to the root account. Also, I set the domain info to bellatlantic.net. Seems to do the right things so far. ( I figure if I post what I've found, it may help someone else, right?) Thanks. -----Original Message----- From: wlug-admin(a)mail.wlug.org [mailto:wlug-admin@mail.wlug.org] On Behalf Of Jim & Toni Sent: Wednesday, October 15, 2003 7:46 AM To: wlug(a)wlug.org Subject: [Wlug] domain settings on dsl with dynamic IP and NAT (and postfix issue) One thing I've never been sure of is what to set the domain to on my Linux box. I'm on verizon dsl with a dynamic IP and PPPOE. I just got a dyndns.org domain with a different hostname than what I have for the machine. I set up the machine to run spamassassin (and to experiment). Machine name = grizzy Dyndns.org address = dibb.homelinux.net Email = jntdibb(a)bellatlantic.net What should I be using for the domain name? Specifically I'm having trouble with some part of postfix or spamc/d. I believe an hourly cron job is trying to send mail to 'root' which causes the following in maillog. I can send my postfix/main.cf file if anyone is interested. Oct 14 13:01:01 grizzy spamd[1921]: connection from grizzy [127.0.0.1] at port 3 3171 Oct 14 13:01:01 grizzy spamd[4504]: info: setuid to postfix succeeded Oct 14 13:01:02 grizzy spamd[4504]: Creating default_prefs [/var/spool/postfix/. spamassassin/user_prefs] Oct 14 13:01:01 grizzy postfix/local[4499]: 49D3FD0B45: to=<postfix(a)localhost.lo calhost>, relay=local, delay=1, status=bounced (can't create user output file. C ommand output: procmail: Couldn't create "/var/spool/mail/postfix" procmail: Loc k failure on "spamassassin.lock" procmail: Program failure (74) of "/usr/bin/spa mc" procmail: Rescue of unfiltered data succeeded ) Oct 14 13:01:01 grizzy postfix/cleanup[4497]: C4A35D0B43: message-id=<2003101417 0101.C4A35D0B43(a)grizzy.bellatlantic.net> Oct 14 13:01:01 grizzy postfix/nqmgr[1920]: C4A35D0B43: from=<>, size=2676, nrcp t=1 (queue active) Here's another example of something wrong. Oct 13 04:02:04 grizzy postfix/pickup[1462]: EFFAFD0B47: uid=0 from=<root> Oct 13 04:02:04 grizzy postfix/cleanup[1781]: EFFAFD0B47: message-id=<2003101308 0203.EFFAFD0B47@grizzy> Oct 13 04:02:04 grizzy postfix/nqmgr[1906]: EFFAFD0B47: from=<root(a)grizzy.grizzy >, size=1093, nrcpt=1 (queue active) Oct 13 04:02:06 grizzy postfix/smtp[1797]: EFFAFD0B47: to=<root(a)grizzy.grizzy>, relay=none, delay=3, status=bounced (Name service error for grizzy.grizzy: Host not found) Oct 13 04:02:06 grizzy postfix/cleanup[1781]: E295BD0B46: message-id=<2003101308 0206.E295BD0B46@grizzy> Oct 13 04:02:07 grizzy postfix/nqmgr[1906]: E295BD0B46: from=<>, size=2614, nrcp t=1 (queue active) Oct 13 04:02:07 grizzy postfix/smtp[1797]: E295BD0B46: to=<root(a)grizzy.grizzy>, relay=none, delay=1, status=bounced (Name service error for grizzy.grizzy: Host not found) Overall, mail handling seems to work. Stuff gets out, stuff comes in, spam gets tagged. But I need to clean some of this up.

Oct. 16, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Fw: RE: show

by Matthew Kwiatkowski

I think this sounds like it's turning into an interesting idea. I would be willing to help out as a cameraman or something behind the scenes, and I do have a laptop with video out, but I would need a ride from campus to the studio. I will also be home on break the week of the 21st, so I can't make that night. -Matthew Kwiatkowski On Wed, 2003-10-15 at 13:39, Yury I Vashugin wrote: > tim, > it seems like we don't have enough people to run the show. maybe > different date and time would be more appropriate for people(depending, > of course, on the studio availability)... > first, we need people to produce the show. it's a commitment of half an > hour ones? a month.(could be ones in two months) is there anyone who > would like to join the venture? > second, we need a qualified show host who will lead the show and > interview guests. i'm a new to linux and i would not dare to discuss it > with my expertize. > third, there is little problem with scan converter which can be replaced > by a notebook with a video output. > a tape of the show will be available immediately after the show and can > be broadcast on any channel(depending on the amount of money, sponsorship > etc; public access channels are free). also it's a good learning tool > which can be multiplied and offered to the public. i still remember a > hot discussion on wlug about introducing linux in public schools. i was > astonished to see how college students buy c compilers for windows to do > their homework for unix/c class. isn't it something? > they know about linux but, o boy, they're scared of it!!!(wow, wow- i'm > not talking about wpi students) > good point was brought by goug. we need to know what audience we are > going to target and where. if we start the show with linux introduction > and discuss the difference between linux and commonly used operating > systems, to get people intrigued, and continuously refer people to 'that > show' then they'll know the connection, how to obtain previous > educational tapes etc. > yury > ps keep forgeting to indicate the studio location- shewsbury media > connection, parker rd. > > > On Wed, 15 Oct 2003 00:40:51 -0400 Andy Stewart <andystewart(a)comcast.net> > writes: > > On Tuesday 14 October 2003 12:55 pm, Yury I Vashugin wrote: > > > hi, everyone. > > > since we talked about producing an educational show about linux > > and > > > putting it 'in-the-air' at the last wlug meeting and i saw a very > > > enthusiastic response so i've reserved the studio for oct.21(see > > below). > > > there's a problem with a converter but i'm sure we can find a > > laptop with > > > a video output. > > > > HI everybody, > > > > I'm still quite enthusiastic about this opportunity, but > > unfortunately I > > cannot make it on October 21st (Tuesday is generally a bad night for > > me). I > > will be looking forward to reading the e-mails from people who do > > make it on > > that date. > > > > Please keep us posted! > > > > Andy > > > > -- > > Andy Stewart, Founder > > Worcester Linux Users' Group > > Worcester, MA USA > > http://www.wlug.org > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wlug mailing list > > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________ > The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! > Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! > Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug

Oct. 16, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Fw: RE: show

by Yury I Vashugin

tim, it seems like we don't have enough people to run the show. maybe different date and time would be more appropriate for people(depending, of course, on the studio availability)... first, we need people to produce the show. it's a commitment of half an hour ones? a month.(could be ones in two months) is there anyone who would like to join the venture? second, we need a qualified show host who will lead the show and interview guests. i'm a new to linux and i would not dare to discuss it with my expertize. third, there is little problem with scan converter which can be replaced by a notebook with a video output. a tape of the show will be available immediately after the show and can be broadcast on any channel(depending on the amount of money, sponsorship etc; public access channels are free). also it's a good learning tool which can be multiplied and offered to the public. i still remember a hot discussion on wlug about introducing linux in public schools. i was astonished to see how college students buy c compilers for windows to do their homework for unix/c class. isn't it something? they know about linux but, o boy, they're scared of it!!!(wow, wow- i'm not talking about wpi students) good point was brought by goug. we need to know what audience we are going to target and where. if we start the show with linux introduction and discuss the difference between linux and commonly used operating systems, to get people intrigued, and continuously refer people to 'that show' then they'll know the connection, how to obtain previous educational tapes etc. yury ps keep forgeting to indicate the studio location- shewsbury media connection, parker rd. On Wed, 15 Oct 2003 00:40:51 -0400 Andy Stewart <andystewart(a)comcast.net> writes: > On Tuesday 14 October 2003 12:55 pm, Yury I Vashugin wrote: > > hi, everyone. > > since we talked about producing an educational show about linux > and > > putting it 'in-the-air' at the last wlug meeting and i saw a very > > enthusiastic response so i've reserved the studio for oct.21(see > below). > > there's a problem with a converter but i'm sure we can find a > laptop with > > a video output. > > HI everybody, > > I'm still quite enthusiastic about this opportunity, but > unfortunately I > cannot make it on October 21st (Tuesday is generally a bad night for > me). I > will be looking forward to reading the e-mails from people who do > make it on > that date. > > Please keep us posted! > > Andy > > -- > Andy Stewart, Founder > Worcester Linux Users' Group > Worcester, MA USA > http://www.wlug.org > > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > > ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today!

Oct. 15, 2003

RE: [Wlug] RE: Wlug digest, Vol 1 #683 - 6 msgs

by Keller, Tim

In my eyes, a well configured box is one where every daemon that doesn't need to be run, is turned off. Sane firewalling rules are in place for the services that do need to be run. Something like redhat network is configured in cron to run once a day and pull updated patches and apply them automagically. You can't expect regular Joe User to become a sysadmin over night. Hence, some forethought and automation have to be used to ensure that his box doesn't get cracked overnight. -----Original Message----- From: bryon3245(a)netzero.com [mailto:bryon3245@netzero.com] Sent: Wednesday, October 15, 2003 11:28 AM To: wlug(a)mail.wlug.org Subject: [Wlug] RE: Wlug digest, Vol 1 #683 - 6 msgs Dear Tim, In response to your letter I would like to say that I run a few gentoo systems. I undetstand the importance of a good fire well land I make sure that my packages are up to date. But when you talk about having "poorly configured linux box" I am very curious as to would you would consider a very good configured box. Message: 6 From: "Keller, Tim" <Tim.Keller(a)stratus.com> To: "'wlug(a)mail.wlug.org'" <wlug(a)mail.wlug.org> Subject: RE: [Wlug] Fw: RE: show Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2003 09:36:10 -0400 charset="iso-8859-1" Reply-To: wlug(a)mail.wlug.org Well, I kind of took it on this tact. My wife really doesn't care about linux, nor windows. When she sits down in front of the computer, she just wants it to work as expected. Past that, she plays a few games, but mainly it revolves around surfing the web, reading email, etc. With that said, I think that the argument for linux has to be made on a couple fronts. Firstly, cost and freedom. Explain to people why linux is a better choice than the perceived "free" copy of windows that came with their computer. I think we should definitely explain the microsoft tax. Second, security. Make it a point of explaining that linux is impervious to the many worms and viruses that are running around the internet. Though we should also caution people that a poorly configured linux box is just as bad (if not worse) than an bare unpatched windows machine. Past that, we should talk to the availability of software for linux. Later, Tim. -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . _______________________________________________ Wlug mailing list Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug

Oct. 15, 2003

RE: Wlug digest, Vol 1 #683 - 6 msgs

by bryon3245＠netzero.com

Dear Tim, In response to your letter I would like to say that I run a few gentoo systems. I undetstand the importance of a good fire well land I make sure that my packages are up to date. But when you talk about having "poorly configured linux box" I am very curious as to would you would consider a very good configured box. Message: 6 From: "Keller, Tim" <Tim.Keller(a)stratus.com> To: "'wlug(a)mail.wlug.org'" <wlug(a)mail.wlug.org> Subject: RE: [Wlug] Fw: RE: show Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2003 09:36:10 -0400 charset="iso-8859-1" Reply-To: wlug(a)mail.wlug.org Well, I kind of took it on this tact. My wife really doesn't care about linux, nor windows. When she sits down in front of the computer, she just wants it to work as expected. Past that, she plays a few games, but mainly it revolves around surfing the web, reading email, etc. With that said, I think that the argument for linux has to be made on a couple fronts. Firstly, cost and freedom. Explain to people why linux is a better choice than the perceived "free" copy of windows that came with their computer. I think we should definitely explain the microsoft tax. Second, security. Make it a point of explaining that linux is impervious to the many worms and viruses that are running around the internet. Though we should also caution people that a poorly configured linux box is just as bad (if not worse) than an bare unpatched windows machine. Past that, we should talk to the availability of software for linux. Later, Tim. -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ .

Oct. 15, 2003

RE: [Wlug] Fw: RE: show

by Keller, Tim

Well, I kind of took it on this tact. My wife really doesn't care about linux, nor windows. When she sits down in front of the computer, she just wants it to work as expected. Past that, she plays a few games, but mainly it revolves around surfing the web, reading email, etc. With that said, I think that the argument for linux has to be made on a couple fronts. Firstly, cost and freedom. Explain to people why linux is a better choice than the perceived "free" copy of windows that came with their computer. I think we should definitely explain the microsoft tax. Second, security. Make it a point of explaining that linux is impervious to the many worms and viruses that are running around the internet. Though we should also caution people that a poorly configured linux box is just as bad (if not worse) than an bare unpatched windows machine. Past that, we should talk to the availability of software for linux. Later, Tim. -----Original Message----- From: Gregory Avedissian [mailto:avedis@rcn.com] Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2003 5:38 PM To: wlug(a)mail.wlug.org Subject: Re: [Wlug] Fw: RE: show Makes sense to me, Tim. Easy replacement is the selling point, and in some ways it's been the stumbling block to my converting entirely to linux. I still use Windows for a couple of tasks that either can't be done in linux (yet) or I haven't figured them out in linux yet (unsupported scanner). Show people that they can do the things they need to do with a minimal amount of effort and without having to pay microsoft, and there will be plenty of converts. Most of the things that most people do with their computers can now be done in linux without having to read a manual, and people need to know that. Greg Keller, Tim wrote: > Yury, > > You can count me in. I also know my way around a TV production studio. > > We had talked about doing an introduction to linux. As an aside to that I > was thinking that possibly we could do a show on equivalent pieces of > software on the linux side of things that could replace (perceived) missing > functionality. This would include stuff like Evolution, Mozilla, GnuCash, > OpenOffice, mplayer, xmms, etc. > > What do people think? > > Thanks, > Tim. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Yury I Vashugin [mailto:vashugins@juno.com] > Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2003 12:56 PM > To: wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > Cc: wlug(a)wlug.org > Subject: [Wlug] Fw: RE: show > > > hi, everyone. > since we talked about producing an educational show about linux and > putting it 'in-the-air' at the last wlug meeting and i saw a very > enthusiastic response so i've reserved the studio for oct.21(see below). > there's a problem with a converter but i'm sure we can find a laptop with > a video output. > for the show we need two cameramen(anyone can do that; very simple duties > and can be learned within 3-5 min), a show host and guests. > please, bring any suggestions or/and recommendations. thanks. > yury > > --------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: Marc Serra <mserra(a)ci.shrewsbury.ma.us> > To: 'Yury I Vashugin' <vashugins(a)juno.com> > Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2003 13:42:56 -0400 > Subject: RE: show > Message-ID: <A7F72312FF5DB348BE2D037A6FE5F1C1407EC2@selpnt2> > > Yes. > > Does anybody in the group have access to a scan converter or can you use > a > computer with a video card output? Since we spoke about it, our last scan > converter was put into service to be used on one of our channel's for our > bulletin board. For you to use it, we would have to take a channel off > the > air. I know that a lot of laptops have video out. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Yury I Vashugin [mailto:vashugins@juno.com] > Sent: Friday, October 10, 2003 11:48 AM > To: mserra(a)ci.shrewsbury.ma.us > Subject: show > > > marc, > can i reserve the studio for half-an-hour show on tuesday, october 21 at > 6:30 (actually it will not be a show; just a preliminary stuff- what > light, what background, what settings we want for 'linux show', to try a > scanner converter etc)? > yury > > ________________________________________________________________ > The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! > Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! > Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > _______________________________________________ Wlug mailing list Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug

Oct. 15, 2003

domain settings on dsl with dynamic IP and NAT (and postfix issue)

by Jim & Toni

One thing I've never been sure of is what to set the domain to on my Linux box. I'm on verizon dsl with a dynamic IP and PPPOE. I just got a dyndns.org domain with a different hostname than what I have for the machine. I set up the machine to run spamassassin (and to experiment). Machine name = grizzy Dyndns.org address = dibb.homelinux.net Email = jntdibb(a)bellatlantic.net What should I be using for the domain name? Specifically I'm having trouble with some part of postfix or spamc/d. I believe an hourly cron job is trying to send mail to 'root' which causes the following in maillog. I can send my postfix/main.cf file if anyone is interested. Oct 14 13:01:01 grizzy spamd[1921]: connection from grizzy [127.0.0.1] at port 3 3171 Oct 14 13:01:01 grizzy spamd[4504]: info: setuid to postfix succeeded Oct 14 13:01:02 grizzy spamd[4504]: Creating default_prefs [/var/spool/postfix/. spamassassin/user_prefs] Oct 14 13:01:01 grizzy postfix/local[4499]: 49D3FD0B45: to=<postfix(a)localhost.lo calhost>, relay=local, delay=1, status=bounced (can't create user output file. C ommand output: procmail: Couldn't create "/var/spool/mail/postfix" procmail: Loc k failure on "spamassassin.lock" procmail: Program failure (74) of "/usr/bin/spa mc" procmail: Rescue of unfiltered data succeeded ) Oct 14 13:01:01 grizzy postfix/cleanup[4497]: C4A35D0B43: message-id=<2003101417 0101.C4A35D0B43(a)grizzy.bellatlantic.net> Oct 14 13:01:01 grizzy postfix/nqmgr[1920]: C4A35D0B43: from=<>, size=2676, nrcp t=1 (queue active) Here's another example of something wrong. Oct 13 04:02:04 grizzy postfix/pickup[1462]: EFFAFD0B47: uid=0 from=<root> Oct 13 04:02:04 grizzy postfix/cleanup[1781]: EFFAFD0B47: message-id=<2003101308 0203.EFFAFD0B47@grizzy> Oct 13 04:02:04 grizzy postfix/nqmgr[1906]: EFFAFD0B47: from=<root(a)grizzy.grizzy >, size=1093, nrcpt=1 (queue active) Oct 13 04:02:06 grizzy postfix/smtp[1797]: EFFAFD0B47: to=<root(a)grizzy.grizzy>, relay=none, delay=3, status=bounced (Name service error for grizzy.grizzy: Host not found) Oct 13 04:02:06 grizzy postfix/cleanup[1781]: E295BD0B46: message-id=<2003101308 0206.E295BD0B46@grizzy> Oct 13 04:02:07 grizzy postfix/nqmgr[1906]: E295BD0B46: from=<>, size=2614, nrcp t=1 (queue active) Oct 13 04:02:07 grizzy postfix/smtp[1797]: E295BD0B46: to=<root(a)grizzy.grizzy>, relay=none, delay=1, status=bounced (Name service error for grizzy.grizzy: Host not found) Overall, mail handling seems to work. Stuff gets out, stuff comes in, spam gets tagged. But I need to clean some of this up.

Oct. 15, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Fw: RE: show

by Andy Stewart

On Tuesday 14 October 2003 12:55 pm, Yury I Vashugin wrote: > hi, everyone. > since we talked about producing an educational show about linux and > putting it 'in-the-air' at the last wlug meeting and i saw a very > enthusiastic response so i've reserved the studio for oct.21(see below). > there's a problem with a converter but i'm sure we can find a laptop with > a video output. HI everybody, I'm still quite enthusiastic about this opportunity, but unfortunately I cannot make it on October 21st (Tuesday is generally a bad night for me). I will be looking forward to reading the e-mails from people who do make it on that date. Please keep us posted! Andy -- Andy Stewart, Founder Worcester Linux Users' Group Worcester, MA USA http://www.wlug.org

Oct. 15, 2003

Re: [Wlug] NIC settings -- how?

by Matt Higgins

These links should get you started. I would be surprised if the distro you are running even supports ipchains. One NIC NAT: http://www.linuxjournal.com/article.php?sid=7175 Netfilter documentation section: http://www.netfilter.org/documentation/index.html iptables HOWTO: http://www.linuxguruz.com/iptables/howto/iptables-HOWTO.html GUI for iptables: http://www.fwbuilder.org/ rc script from linuhttp://www.linuxgazette.com/issue76/misc/whitmarsh/rc.firewall.sh.txtxg… artile:

Oct. 15, 2003

Re: [Wlug] NIC settings -- how?

by Keith Wright

> From: David Goss <vze2bd6u(a)verizon.net> > > have the pppoe all set up... but can't for the life of me remember > how to set up the ipchains to handle the windows boxes for the wife > and kids... and man they are getting hostile about not being able to > get on the internet from home... i know it was not that hard to set > up but for the life of me i can not find the docs i used in the > first place... Well, if you are starting from scratch you might as well use iptables instead of ipchains, which are nearing obsolete. Here is my "gateway" script. It is a firewall with a big hole in it. It protects the windows machines just by trusting the ISP not to route local addresses to you from outside. (I assume your Windows machines are 192.168.0.???, or similar.) Once you have a gateway working you can play with it to turn it into a real firewall. I have two ethernet cards in the firewall machine, one connected to the DSL modem one to the LAN. You don't say if you have the same. I think the below should work with one card, forwarding both from and to the LAN, but have not tried it. Also, I have a static IP address build into the script. I think to use PPPoE you need to change the last line, but again have not tried it. ------------------- #!/bin/bash /etc/sysconfig/network-scripts/ifup eth1 /sbin/rmmod ipchains /sbin/modprobe ip_conntrack_ftp echo "1" >/proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward IPT="/sbin/iptables" INTERNET_ETHER="eth0" FCS_ETHER="eth1" GATEWAY_IP="66.92.74.1" FCS_IP="66.92.74.188" $IPT -t filter --flush $IPT -t nat --flush $IPT -t mangle --flush $IPT -A INPUT -i lo -j ACCEPT $IPT -A OUTPUT -o lo -j ACCEPT $IPT -t filter --policy INPUT ACCEPT $IPT -t filter --policy OUTPUT ACCEPT $IPT -t filter --policy FORWARD ACCEPT $IPT -t nat --policy PREROUTING ACCEPT $IPT -t nat --policy OUTPUT ACCEPT $IPT -t nat --policy POSTROUTING ACCEPT $IPT -t mangle --policy PREROUTING ACCEPT $IPT -t mangle --policy OUTPUT ACCEPT $IPT -t nat -A POSTROUTING -o $INTERNET_ETHER -j SNAT --to-source $FCS_IP ------------------ For PPPoE, change that last line to $IPT -t nat -A POSTROUTING -o $INTERNET_ETHER -j MASQURADE -- Keith

Oct. 15, 2003

Re: [Wlug] problem hardware?

by Baris Hasdemir

On Tue, 2003-10-14 at 16:05, Charles R. Anderson wrote: > On Tue, Oct 14, 2003 at 03:55:02PM -0400, Baris Hasdemir wrote: > > no. The region should be "1" I got this dvd from the shrewsbury public > > library. and actually it is playing the dvd without any problems. I am > > using xine to play it. the only problem is those error messages. > > Well, if it works I wouldn't worry about it. It is likely that xine > is trying "region 0" for playing DVDs from any region, although this > is just a guess. Do I need to set a region code? Here is what I think, I used my first dvd-rom first with a windows system. Probably the player there, changed the region setting to the first DVD that I put in it. But for a long time I do not have windows on my computer, so this new drive has born directly into linux. In linux do we still have region codes? If yes, may be that error is because I am expected to decide on a region? I found a utility regionset http://sourceforge.net/projects/dvd/ here is its output: ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ root@penguen:~# ./regionset /dev/dvd Current Region Code settings: RPC Phase: II type: NONE vendor resets available: 4 user controlled changes resets available: 5 drive plays discs from region(s):, mask=0xFF Would you like to change the region setting of your drive? [y/n]:n ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ I could not decide whether a region is set already(by xine, or libdvdread or something...) or not. Other than region setting error it looks like I have a "driveready seekcomplete error" problem. What does this error mean? I get this error when I play a dvd: ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Oct 14 17:00:56 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete Error } Oct 14 17:00:56 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: error=0x54 Oct 14 17:00:56 penguen kernel: ATAPI device hdd: Oct 14 17:00:56 penguen kernel: Error: Illegal request -- (Sense key=0x05) Oct 14 17:00:56 penguen kernel: Media region code is mismatched to logical unit -- (asc=0x6f, ascq=0x04) Oct 14 17:00:56 penguen kernel: The failed "Report Key" packet command was: Oct 14 17:00:56 penguen kernel: "a4 00 00 2b 0f 60 00 00 00 0c c4 00 " and I get this when I mount and look in a cd/dvd: ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Oct 14 17:14:26 penguen kernel: hdd: command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete Error } Oct 14 17:14:26 penguen kernel: hdd: command error: error=0x54 Oct 14 17:14:26 penguen kernel: end_request: I/O error, dev 16:40 (hdd), sector 1792 thanks, baris

Oct. 14, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Fw: RE: show

by Gregory Avedissian

Makes sense to me, Tim. Easy replacement is the selling point, and in some ways it's been the stumbling block to my converting entirely to linux. I still use Windows for a couple of tasks that either can't be done in linux (yet) or I haven't figured them out in linux yet (unsupported scanner). Show people that they can do the things they need to do with a minimal amount of effort and without having to pay microsoft, and there will be plenty of converts. Most of the things that most people do with their computers can now be done in linux without having to read a manual, and people need to know that. Greg Keller, Tim wrote: > Yury, > > You can count me in. I also know my way around a TV production studio. > > We had talked about doing an introduction to linux. As an aside to that I > was thinking that possibly we could do a show on equivalent pieces of > software on the linux side of things that could replace (perceived) missing > functionality. This would include stuff like Evolution, Mozilla, GnuCash, > OpenOffice, mplayer, xmms, etc. > > What do people think? > > Thanks, > Tim. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Yury I Vashugin [mailto:vashugins@juno.com] > Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2003 12:56 PM > To: wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > Cc: wlug(a)wlug.org > Subject: [Wlug] Fw: RE: show > > > hi, everyone. > since we talked about producing an educational show about linux and > putting it 'in-the-air' at the last wlug meeting and i saw a very > enthusiastic response so i've reserved the studio for oct.21(see below). > there's a problem with a converter but i'm sure we can find a laptop with > a video output. > for the show we need two cameramen(anyone can do that; very simple duties > and can be learned within 3-5 min), a show host and guests. > please, bring any suggestions or/and recommendations. thanks. > yury > > --------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: Marc Serra <mserra(a)ci.shrewsbury.ma.us> > To: 'Yury I Vashugin' <vashugins(a)juno.com> > Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2003 13:42:56 -0400 > Subject: RE: show > Message-ID: <A7F72312FF5DB348BE2D037A6FE5F1C1407EC2@selpnt2> > > Yes. > > Does anybody in the group have access to a scan converter or can you use > a > computer with a video card output? Since we spoke about it, our last scan > converter was put into service to be used on one of our channel's for our > bulletin board. For you to use it, we would have to take a channel off > the > air. I know that a lot of laptops have video out. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Yury I Vashugin [mailto:vashugins@juno.com] > Sent: Friday, October 10, 2003 11:48 AM > To: mserra(a)ci.shrewsbury.ma.us > Subject: show > > > marc, > can i reserve the studio for half-an-hour show on tuesday, october 21 at > 6:30 (actually it will not be a show; just a preliminary stuff- what > light, what background, what settings we want for 'linux show', to try a > scanner converter etc)? > yury > > ________________________________________________________________ > The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! > Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! > Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > >

Oct. 14, 2003

Re: [Wlug] problem hardware?

by Charles R. Anderson

On Tue, Oct 14, 2003 at 03:55:02PM -0400, Baris Hasdemir wrote: > no. The region should be "1" I got this dvd from the shrewsbury public > library. and actually it is playing the dvd without any problems. I am > using xine to play it. the only problem is those error messages. Well, if it works I wouldn't worry about it. It is likely that xine is trying "region 0" for playing DVDs from any region, although this is just a guess. -- Charles R. Anderson <cra(a)wpi.edu> / http://angus.ind.wpi.edu/~cra/ PGP Key ID: 49BB5886 Fingerprint: EBA3 A106 7C93 FA07 8E15 3AC2 C367 A0F9 49BB 5886

Oct. 14, 2003

Re: [Wlug] problem hardware?

by Baris Hasdemir

no. The region should be "1" I got this dvd from the shrewsbury public library. and actually it is playing the dvd without any problems. I am using xine to play it. the only problem is those error messages. On Tue, 2003-10-14 at 15:33, gboyce(a)badbelly.com wrote: > The error given here "Media region code is mismatched to logical unit" > sounds like the drive believes that it's not allowed to read content of > that type. Are you trying to view a non-US/Canada movie in the drive? > > On Tue, 14 Oct 2003, Baris Hasdemir wrote: > > > Hello all, > > > > Today I received my slot loading pioneer dvd rom drive from newegg.com. > > But linux tells me there are problems with it. The problem is my new > > hardware right? Or should I upgrade my kernel? I wanted to be sure > > before sending it back. > > > > kernel 2.4.22(slackware 9.1) > > > > thanks, > > baris > > > > # tail -f /var/log/syslog > > Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { > > DriveReady SeekComplete Error } > > Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: error=0x54 > > Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: ATAPI device hdd: > > Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: Error: Illegal request -- (Sense > > key=0x05) > > Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: Media region code is mismatched to > > logical unit -- (asc=0x6f, ascq=0x04) > > Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: The failed "Report Key" packet command > > was: > > Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: "a4 00 00 00 01 26 00 00 00 0c c4 00 " > > Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { > > DriveReady SeekComplete Error } > > Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: error=0x54 > > Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: ATAPI device hdd: > > Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: Error: Illegal request -- (Sense > > key=0x05) > > Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: Media region code is mismatched to > > logical unit -- (asc=0x6f, ascq=0x04) > > Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: The failed "Report Key" packet command > > was: > > Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: "a4 00 00 00 02 3d 00 00 00 0c c4 00 " > > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { > > DriveReady SeekComplete Error } > > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: error=0x54 > > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: ATAPI device hdd: > > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: Error: Illegal request -- (Sense > > key=0x05) > > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: Media region code is mismatched to > > logical unit -- (asc=0x6f, ascq=0x04) > > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: The failed "Report Key" packet command > > was: > > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: "a4 00 00 00 02 ad 00 00 00 0c c4 00 " > > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { > > DriveReady SeekComplete Error } > > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: error=0x54 > > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: ATAPI device hdd: > > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: Error: Illegal request -- (Sense > > key=0x05) > > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: Media region code is mismatched to > > logical unit -- (asc=0x6f, ascq=0x04) > > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: The failed "Report Key" packet command > > was: > > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: "a4 00 00 00 02 dc 00 00 00 0c c4 00 " > > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { > > DriveReady SeekComplete Error } > > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: error=0x54 > > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: ATAPI device hdd: > > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: Error: Illegal request -- (Sense > > key=0x05) > > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: Media region code is mismatched to > > logical unit -- (asc=0x6f, ascq=0x04) > > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: The failed "Report Key" packet command > > was: > > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: "a4 00 00 00 0a 2b 00 00 00 0c c4 00 " > > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { > > DriveReady SeekComplete Error } > > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: error=0x54 > > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: ATAPI device hdd: > > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: Error: Illegal request -- (Sense > > key=0x05) > > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: Media region code is mismatched to > > logical unit -- (asc=0x6f, ascq=0x04) > > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: The failed "Report Key" packet command > > was: > > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: "a4 00 00 20 f9 76 00 00 00 0c c4 00 " > > Oct 14 14:39:47 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { > > DriveReady SeekComplete Error } > > Oct 14 14:39:47 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: error=0x54 > > Oct 14 14:39:47 penguen kernel: ATAPI device hdd: > > Oct 14 14:39:47 penguen kernel: Error: Illegal request -- (Sense > > key=0x05) > > Oct 14 14:39:47 penguen kernel: Media region code is mismatched to > > logical unit -- (asc=0x6f, ascq=0x04) > > Oct 14 14:39:47 penguen kernel: The failed "Report Key" packet command > > was: > > Oct 14 14:39:47 penguen kernel: "a4 00 00 20 f9 e6 00 00 00 0c c4 00 " > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wlug mailing list > > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > >

Oct. 14, 2003

Re: [Wlug] problem hardware?

by gboyce＠badbelly.com

The error given here "Media region code is mismatched to logical unit" sounds like the drive believes that it's not allowed to read content of that type. Are you trying to view a non-US/Canada movie in the drive? On Tue, 14 Oct 2003, Baris Hasdemir wrote: > Hello all, > > Today I received my slot loading pioneer dvd rom drive from newegg.com. > But linux tells me there are problems with it. The problem is my new > hardware right? Or should I upgrade my kernel? I wanted to be sure > before sending it back. > > kernel 2.4.22(slackware 9.1) > > thanks, > baris > > # tail -f /var/log/syslog > Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { > DriveReady SeekComplete Error } > Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: error=0x54 > Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: ATAPI device hdd: > Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: Error: Illegal request -- (Sense > key=0x05) > Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: Media region code is mismatched to > logical unit -- (asc=0x6f, ascq=0x04) > Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: The failed "Report Key" packet command > was: > Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: "a4 00 00 00 01 26 00 00 00 0c c4 00 " > Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { > DriveReady SeekComplete Error } > Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: error=0x54 > Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: ATAPI device hdd: > Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: Error: Illegal request -- (Sense > key=0x05) > Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: Media region code is mismatched to > logical unit -- (asc=0x6f, ascq=0x04) > Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: The failed "Report Key" packet command > was: > Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: "a4 00 00 00 02 3d 00 00 00 0c c4 00 " > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { > DriveReady SeekComplete Error } > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: error=0x54 > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: ATAPI device hdd: > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: Error: Illegal request -- (Sense > key=0x05) > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: Media region code is mismatched to > logical unit -- (asc=0x6f, ascq=0x04) > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: The failed "Report Key" packet command > was: > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: "a4 00 00 00 02 ad 00 00 00 0c c4 00 " > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { > DriveReady SeekComplete Error } > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: error=0x54 > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: ATAPI device hdd: > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: Error: Illegal request -- (Sense > key=0x05) > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: Media region code is mismatched to > logical unit -- (asc=0x6f, ascq=0x04) > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: The failed "Report Key" packet command > was: > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: "a4 00 00 00 02 dc 00 00 00 0c c4 00 " > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { > DriveReady SeekComplete Error } > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: error=0x54 > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: ATAPI device hdd: > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: Error: Illegal request -- (Sense > key=0x05) > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: Media region code is mismatched to > logical unit -- (asc=0x6f, ascq=0x04) > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: The failed "Report Key" packet command > was: > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: "a4 00 00 00 0a 2b 00 00 00 0c c4 00 " > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { > DriveReady SeekComplete Error } > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: error=0x54 > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: ATAPI device hdd: > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: Error: Illegal request -- (Sense > key=0x05) > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: Media region code is mismatched to > logical unit -- (asc=0x6f, ascq=0x04) > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: The failed "Report Key" packet command > was: > Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: "a4 00 00 20 f9 76 00 00 00 0c c4 00 " > Oct 14 14:39:47 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { > DriveReady SeekComplete Error } > Oct 14 14:39:47 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: error=0x54 > Oct 14 14:39:47 penguen kernel: ATAPI device hdd: > Oct 14 14:39:47 penguen kernel: Error: Illegal request -- (Sense > key=0x05) > Oct 14 14:39:47 penguen kernel: Media region code is mismatched to > logical unit -- (asc=0x6f, ascq=0x04) > Oct 14 14:39:47 penguen kernel: The failed "Report Key" packet command > was: > Oct 14 14:39:47 penguen kernel: "a4 00 00 20 f9 e6 00 00 00 0c c4 00 " > > > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug >

Oct. 14, 2003

problem hardware?

by Baris Hasdemir

Hello all, Today I received my slot loading pioneer dvd rom drive from newegg.com. But linux tells me there are problems with it. The problem is my new hardware right? Or should I upgrade my kernel? I wanted to be sure before sending it back. kernel 2.4.22(slackware 9.1) thanks, baris # tail -f /var/log/syslog Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete Error } Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: error=0x54 Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: ATAPI device hdd: Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: Error: Illegal request -- (Sense key=0x05) Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: Media region code is mismatched to logical unit -- (asc=0x6f, ascq=0x04) Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: The failed "Report Key" packet command was: Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: "a4 00 00 00 01 26 00 00 00 0c c4 00 " Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete Error } Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: error=0x54 Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: ATAPI device hdd: Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: Error: Illegal request -- (Sense key=0x05) Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: Media region code is mismatched to logical unit -- (asc=0x6f, ascq=0x04) Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: The failed "Report Key" packet command was: Oct 14 14:39:45 penguen kernel: "a4 00 00 00 02 3d 00 00 00 0c c4 00 " Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete Error } Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: error=0x54 Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: ATAPI device hdd: Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: Error: Illegal request -- (Sense key=0x05) Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: Media region code is mismatched to logical unit -- (asc=0x6f, ascq=0x04) Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: The failed "Report Key" packet command was: Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: "a4 00 00 00 02 ad 00 00 00 0c c4 00 " Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete Error } Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: error=0x54 Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: ATAPI device hdd: Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: Error: Illegal request -- (Sense key=0x05) Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: Media region code is mismatched to logical unit -- (asc=0x6f, ascq=0x04) Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: The failed "Report Key" packet command was: Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: "a4 00 00 00 02 dc 00 00 00 0c c4 00 " Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete Error } Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: error=0x54 Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: ATAPI device hdd: Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: Error: Illegal request -- (Sense key=0x05) Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: Media region code is mismatched to logical unit -- (asc=0x6f, ascq=0x04) Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: The failed "Report Key" packet command was: Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: "a4 00 00 00 0a 2b 00 00 00 0c c4 00 " Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete Error } Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: error=0x54 Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: ATAPI device hdd: Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: Error: Illegal request -- (Sense key=0x05) Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: Media region code is mismatched to logical unit -- (asc=0x6f, ascq=0x04) Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: The failed "Report Key" packet command was: Oct 14 14:39:46 penguen kernel: "a4 00 00 20 f9 76 00 00 00 0c c4 00 " Oct 14 14:39:47 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete Error } Oct 14 14:39:47 penguen kernel: hdd: packet command error: error=0x54 Oct 14 14:39:47 penguen kernel: ATAPI device hdd: Oct 14 14:39:47 penguen kernel: Error: Illegal request -- (Sense key=0x05) Oct 14 14:39:47 penguen kernel: Media region code is mismatched to logical unit -- (asc=0x6f, ascq=0x04) Oct 14 14:39:47 penguen kernel: The failed "Report Key" packet command was: Oct 14 14:39:47 penguen kernel: "a4 00 00 20 f9 e6 00 00 00 0c c4 00 "

Oct. 14, 2003

RE: [Wlug] Fw: RE: show

by mlong＠datalong.com

That sounds like a great topic. This could be expanded to include mini tutorials scattered about in subsequent shows explaining how to achieve the same functionality in the various apps. Cheers, Mike > Yury, > > You can count me in. I also know my way around a TV production studio. > > We had talked about doing an introduction to linux. As an aside to that I > was thinking that possibly we could do a show on equivalent pieces of > software on the linux side of things that could replace (perceived) > missing > functionality. This would include stuff like Evolution, Mozilla, GnuCash, > OpenOffice, mplayer, xmms, etc. > > What do people think?

Oct. 14, 2003

RE: [Wlug] Fw: RE: show

by Keller, Tim

Yury, You can count me in. I also know my way around a TV production studio. We had talked about doing an introduction to linux. As an aside to that I was thinking that possibly we could do a show on equivalent pieces of software on the linux side of things that could replace (perceived) missing functionality. This would include stuff like Evolution, Mozilla, GnuCash, OpenOffice, mplayer, xmms, etc. What do people think? Thanks, Tim. -----Original Message----- From: Yury I Vashugin [mailto:vashugins@juno.com] Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2003 12:56 PM To: wlug(a)mail.wlug.org Cc: wlug(a)wlug.org Subject: [Wlug] Fw: RE: show hi, everyone. since we talked about producing an educational show about linux and putting it 'in-the-air' at the last wlug meeting and i saw a very enthusiastic response so i've reserved the studio for oct.21(see below). there's a problem with a converter but i'm sure we can find a laptop with a video output. for the show we need two cameramen(anyone can do that; very simple duties and can be learned within 3-5 min), a show host and guests. please, bring any suggestions or/and recommendations. thanks. yury --------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Marc Serra <mserra(a)ci.shrewsbury.ma.us> To: 'Yury I Vashugin' <vashugins(a)juno.com> Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2003 13:42:56 -0400 Subject: RE: show Message-ID: <A7F72312FF5DB348BE2D037A6FE5F1C1407EC2@selpnt2> Yes. Does anybody in the group have access to a scan converter or can you use a computer with a video card output? Since we spoke about it, our last scan converter was put into service to be used on one of our channel's for our bulletin board. For you to use it, we would have to take a channel off the air. I know that a lot of laptops have video out. -----Original Message----- From: Yury I Vashugin [mailto:vashugins@juno.com] Sent: Friday, October 10, 2003 11:48 AM To: mserra(a)ci.shrewsbury.ma.us Subject: show marc, can i reserve the studio for half-an-hour show on tuesday, october 21 at 6:30 (actually it will not be a show; just a preliminary stuff- what light, what background, what settings we want for 'linux show', to try a scanner converter etc)? yury ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ Wlug mailing list Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug

Oct. 14, 2003

Fw: RE: show

by Yury I Vashugin

hi, everyone. since we talked about producing an educational show about linux and putting it 'in-the-air' at the last wlug meeting and i saw a very enthusiastic response so i've reserved the studio for oct.21(see below). there's a problem with a converter but i'm sure we can find a laptop with a video output. for the show we need two cameramen(anyone can do that; very simple duties and can be learned within 3-5 min), a show host and guests. please, bring any suggestions or/and recommendations. thanks. yury --------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Marc Serra <mserra(a)ci.shrewsbury.ma.us> To: 'Yury I Vashugin' <vashugins(a)juno.com> Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2003 13:42:56 -0400 Subject: RE: show Message-ID: <A7F72312FF5DB348BE2D037A6FE5F1C1407EC2@selpnt2> Yes. Does anybody in the group have access to a scan converter or can you use a computer with a video card output? Since we spoke about it, our last scan converter was put into service to be used on one of our channel's for our bulletin board. For you to use it, we would have to take a channel off the air. I know that a lot of laptops have video out. -----Original Message----- From: Yury I Vashugin [mailto:vashugins@juno.com] Sent: Friday, October 10, 2003 11:48 AM To: mserra(a)ci.shrewsbury.ma.us Subject: show marc, can i reserve the studio for half-an-hour show on tuesday, october 21 at 6:30 (actually it will not be a show; just a preliminary stuff- what light, what background, what settings we want for 'linux show', to try a scanner converter etc)? yury ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today!

Oct. 14, 2003

Re: [Wlug] You can't get there from here...

by Gregory Avedissian

Andy Stewart wrote: > On Monday 13 October 2003 2:28 pm, Gregory Avedissian wrote: > >>Lowres won't work. The problem is it sees the S3Virge chip on the vid >>card and wants to use the s3virge driver, when it should really be using >>the 3DLabs driver. In the old sax, it tries to run in lowres first, and >>it comes up very large and hanging way over the edge of my screen. What >>I've found to work is this - >>sax -h 30-70 -v 50-150 -a 1024x768 -s XF86_3DLabs > > > The "very large and hanging way over the edge of my screen" problem is most > likely a funky "modelines" line in your XF86Config file. This can often be > remedied by manually adjusting your monitor, or by running (carefully!) > xvidtune and noting the new mode line once the screen is properly adjusted. > This new mode line would then be hand edited into your XF86Config file. If > the XFree86 v3.x driver (XF86_3DLabs) works for you, there may be no need to > fuss with the v4.x XFree86 driver. > > >>I've read the help screen for sax2 a bunch of times, and I don't >>understand how to give it the same information. >> >>sax2 -m 0=vga sort of works. I get a 320x200 image that fills the bottom >>half of my screen and bleeds way off the right edge. >> >>sax2 -m 0=glint quits and gives me error messages (no device found - the >>card has a glint 500tx accelerator) >> >>sax2 -m 0=s3virge goes black and locks up, only reset button gets me out >> > > > Which version of XFree86 4.x are you trying to use? If you are having > problems like this, you most likely need the latest and greatest. However, I > have seen cases where XFree86 v3.x works better than v4.x, especially on > "weird" video cards that are getting on in years. > > Later, > > Andy I'm trying to use 4.1.0. The 3Dlabs driver didn't come with 3.3.6. I had to find it online and unpack it. I also ran the Xinstall script that came with the 4.1.0 tarballs. I thought it had replaced all my files, so I can't tell you for sure which version is really running. I just tried again to run sax2 -m 0=vga, and it ran fine at 640x480. I'm not sure what's different now, but I did install some other packages this afternoon, like openmotif devel and some font packages. Anyway, sax2 does not list my vid card, but sax does. Maybe I should just leave this alone for now, since it works. If it's the source of the kde problem, I can live with it as long as my function keys work. BTW, I had asked you about my other machine, which wouldn't let me switch virtual screens. Turns out my nifty new keyboard has about 10 special buttons for web surfing, and one of them turns off the function keys. Thanks, Greg

Oct. 13, 2003

Re: [Wlug] You can't get there from here...

by Andy Stewart

On Monday 13 October 2003 2:28 pm, Gregory Avedissian wrote: > > Lowres won't work. The problem is it sees the S3Virge chip on the vid > card and wants to use the s3virge driver, when it should really be using > the 3DLabs driver. In the old sax, it tries to run in lowres first, and > it comes up very large and hanging way over the edge of my screen. What > I've found to work is this - > sax -h 30-70 -v 50-150 -a 1024x768 -s XF86_3DLabs The "very large and hanging way over the edge of my screen" problem is most likely a funky "modelines" line in your XF86Config file. This can often be remedied by manually adjusting your monitor, or by running (carefully!) xvidtune and noting the new mode line once the screen is properly adjusted. This new mode line would then be hand edited into your XF86Config file. If the XFree86 v3.x driver (XF86_3DLabs) works for you, there may be no need to fuss with the v4.x XFree86 driver. > > I've read the help screen for sax2 a bunch of times, and I don't > understand how to give it the same information. > > sax2 -m 0=vga sort of works. I get a 320x200 image that fills the bottom > half of my screen and bleeds way off the right edge. > > sax2 -m 0=glint quits and gives me error messages (no device found - the > card has a glint 500tx accelerator) > > sax2 -m 0=s3virge goes black and locks up, only reset button gets me out > Which version of XFree86 4.x are you trying to use? If you are having problems like this, you most likely need the latest and greatest. However, I have seen cases where XFree86 v3.x works better than v4.x, especially on "weird" video cards that are getting on in years. Later, Andy -- Andy Stewart, Founder Worcester Linux Users' Group Worcester, MA USA http://www.wlug.org

Oct. 13, 2003

Re: [Wlug] You can't get there from here...

by Andy Stewart

On Monday 13 October 2003 2:28 pm, Gregory Avedissian wrote: > >> > >>I'm thinking it might have to do with my funky vid card (ELSA GLoria-L). > >>Sax2 won't run on this machine - it goes to a black screen that won't > >>respond to any keystrokes except the reset button. I had to setup XFree > >>4.1 with the old sax, passing monitor and server parameters to it on the > >>command line for it to run correctly (hsync, vsync, screen resolution > >>and server). Sax2 doesn't seem to have the same switches. Is it bad to > >>setup newer versions of X with sax instead of sax2? > >> > >>BTW, I had a lot of trouble setting up the older version of XFree from > >>the CD's, too. > >> > >>Greg > > > > HI Greg, > > > > I think sax2 has a command line switch to force it to run in a low res > > mode, and I believe it is "-l" (minus ell). I've succeeded in using this > > with all sorts of strange hardware. This switch is not the default. > > > > sax is designed for XFree86 3.x, while sax2 is designed for XFree86 4.x. > > SuSE seems to be geared to more easily handle XFree86 4.x. > > > > See if you can get this graphics card to run in 640x480 8-bit color mode > > first, and if you succeed, then get brave and attempt higher resolutions > > afterwards. > > > > Later, > > > > Andy > > Andy, > > Lowres won't work. The problem is it sees the S3Virge chip on the vid > card and wants to use the s3virge driver, when it should really be using > the 3DLabs driver. In the old sax, it tries to run in lowres first, and > it comes up very large and hanging way over the edge of my screen. What > I've found to work is this - > sax -h 30-70 -v 50-150 -a 1024x768 -s XF86_3DLabs > > I've read the help screen for sax2 a bunch of times, and I don't > understand how to give it the same information. > > sax2 -m 0=vga sort of works. I get a 320x200 image that fills the bottom > half of my screen and bleeds way off the right edge. > > sax2 -m 0=glint quits and gives me error messages (no device found - the > card has a glint 500tx accelerator) > > sax2 -m 0=s3virge goes black and locks up, only reset button gets me out > > Can't figure out the proper syntax for the --xmode option to set the > screen resolution or hsync, and setting vsync doesn't seem to be an > option. If you know this secret, I'll buy you a beer. > > > Greg > > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug -- Andy Stewart, Founder Worcester Linux Users' Group Worcester, MA USA http://www.wlug.org

Oct. 13, 2003

RE: [Wlug] FW: Authentication on outgoing SMTP, how to set with postfix?

by Jim & Toni

Well, found the answer here. http://sdb.suselinux.hu/en/sdb/html/rsimai_imap_smtp_auth.html -----Original Message----- From: Jim & Toni [mailto:jntdibb@bellatlantic.net] Sent: Monday, October 13, 2003 2:28 PM To: 'wlug(a)wlug.org' Subject: Authentication on outgoing SMTP, how to set with postfix? I've almost got postfix setup as a mail relay from my local linux box to 'outgoing.verizon.net'. But, the postfix howto doesn't specify how to provide login/password authentication for smtp servers that require it. The error was '554: Authentication required' Going to search more, but appreciate any help. Thanks.

Oct. 13, 2003

FW: Authentication on outgoing SMTP, how to set with postfix?

by Jim & Toni

Sorry if you get multiples, like it says, having trouble with outgoing. Thanks. -----Original Message----- From: Jim & Toni [mailto:jntdibb@bellatlantic.net] Sent: Monday, October 13, 2003 2:28 PM To: 'wlug(a)wlug.org' Subject: Authentication on outgoing SMTP, how to set with postfix? I've almost got postfix setup as a mail relay from my local linux box to 'outgoing.verizon.net'. But, the postfix howto doesn't specify how to provide login/password authentication for smtp servers that require it. The error was '554: Authentication required' Going to search more, but appreciate any help. Thanks.

Oct. 13, 2003

Re: [Wlug] You can't get there from here...

by Gregory Avedissian

Andy Stewart wrote: > On Monday 13 October 2003 9:13 am, Gregory Avedissian wrote: > >>Same thing happens with any user, and the problem spans two consecutive >>installations on the same machine. The problem doesn't exist on my other >>machine, even though I intalled the same stuff. >> >>I'm thinking it might have to do with my funky vid card (ELSA GLoria-L). >>Sax2 won't run on this machine - it goes to a black screen that won't >>respond to any keystrokes except the reset button. I had to setup XFree >>4.1 with the old sax, passing monitor and server parameters to it on the >>command line for it to run correctly (hsync, vsync, screen resolution >>and server). Sax2 doesn't seem to have the same switches. Is it bad to >>setup newer versions of X with sax instead of sax2? >> >>BTW, I had a lot of trouble setting up the older version of XFree from >>the CD's, too. >> >>Greg > > > HI Greg, > > I think sax2 has a command line switch to force it to run in a low res mode, > and I believe it is "-l" (minus ell). I've succeeded in using this with all > sorts of strange hardware. This switch is not the default. > > sax is designed for XFree86 3.x, while sax2 is designed for XFree86 4.x. SuSE > seems to be geared to more easily handle XFree86 4.x. > > See if you can get this graphics card to run in 640x480 8-bit color mode > first, and if you succeed, then get brave and attempt higher resolutions > afterwards. > > Later, > > Andy > > Andy, Lowres won't work. The problem is it sees the S3Virge chip on the vid card and wants to use the s3virge driver, when it should really be using the 3DLabs driver. In the old sax, it tries to run in lowres first, and it comes up very large and hanging way over the edge of my screen. What I've found to work is this - sax -h 30-70 -v 50-150 -a 1024x768 -s XF86_3DLabs I've read the help screen for sax2 a bunch of times, and I don't understand how to give it the same information. sax2 -m 0=vga sort of works. I get a 320x200 image that fills the bottom half of my screen and bleeds way off the right edge. sax2 -m 0=glint quits and gives me error messages (no device found - the card has a glint 500tx accelerator) sax2 -m 0=s3virge goes black and locks up, only reset button gets me out Can't figure out the proper syntax for the --xmode option to set the screen resolution or hsync, and setting vsync doesn't seem to be an option. If you know this secret, I'll buy you a beer. Greg

Oct. 13, 2003

Re: [Wlug] You can't get there from here...

by Andy Stewart

On Monday 13 October 2003 9:13 am, Gregory Avedissian wrote: > > Same thing happens with any user, and the problem spans two consecutive > installations on the same machine. The problem doesn't exist on my other > machine, even though I intalled the same stuff. > > I'm thinking it might have to do with my funky vid card (ELSA GLoria-L). > Sax2 won't run on this machine - it goes to a black screen that won't > respond to any keystrokes except the reset button. I had to setup XFree > 4.1 with the old sax, passing monitor and server parameters to it on the > command line for it to run correctly (hsync, vsync, screen resolution > and server). Sax2 doesn't seem to have the same switches. Is it bad to > setup newer versions of X with sax instead of sax2? > > BTW, I had a lot of trouble setting up the older version of XFree from > the CD's, too. > > Greg HI Greg, I think sax2 has a command line switch to force it to run in a low res mode, and I believe it is "-l" (minus ell). I've succeeded in using this with all sorts of strange hardware. This switch is not the default. sax is designed for XFree86 3.x, while sax2 is designed for XFree86 4.x. SuSE seems to be geared to more easily handle XFree86 4.x. See if you can get this graphics card to run in 640x480 8-bit color mode first, and if you succeed, then get brave and attempt higher resolutions afterwards. Later, Andy -- Andy Stewart, Founder Worcester Linux Users' Group Worcester, MA USA http://www.wlug.org

Oct. 13, 2003

Re: [Wlug] You can't get there from here...

by Gregory Avedissian

Andy Stewart wrote: > On Sunday 12 October 2003 2:25 pm, Gregory Avedissian wrote: > >>At the meeting last Thursday, I asked about a problem I'm having with >>KDE desktop, and Tim mentioned I should run 'tail -f /var/log/messages' >>in another terminal while loading KDE. > > > Hi Greg, > > What happens if you create a brand new user, and then log in as that user and > fire up KDE? I'm wondering if there is a system problem or if something is > fubar in one of your user specific KDE files. > > Later, > > Andy Hi Andy, Same thing happens with any user, and the problem spans two consecutive installations on the same machine. The problem doesn't exist on my other machine, even though I intalled the same stuff. I'm thinking it might have to do with my funky vid card (ELSA GLoria-L). Sax2 won't run on this machine - it goes to a black screen that won't respond to any keystrokes except the reset button. I had to setup XFree 4.1 with the old sax, passing monitor and server parameters to it on the command line for it to run correctly (hsync, vsync, screen resolution and server). Sax2 doesn't seem to have the same switches. Is it bad to setup newer versions of X with sax instead of sax2? BTW, I had a lot of trouble setting up the older version of XFree from the CD's, too. Greg

Oct. 13, 2003

Re: [Wlug] You can't get there from here...

by Andy Stewart

On Sunday 12 October 2003 2:25 pm, Gregory Avedissian wrote: > At the meeting last Thursday, I asked about a problem I'm having with > KDE desktop, and Tim mentioned I should run 'tail -f /var/log/messages' > in another terminal while loading KDE. Hi Greg, What happens if you create a brand new user, and then log in as that user and fire up KDE? I'm wondering if there is a system problem or if something is fubar in one of your user specific KDE files. Later, Andy -- Andy Stewart, Founder Worcester Linux Users' Group Worcester, MA USA http://www.wlug.org

Oct. 13, 2003

You can't get there from here...

by Gregory Avedissian

At the meeting last Thursday, I asked about a problem I'm having with KDE desktop, and Tim mentioned I should run 'tail -f /var/log/messages' in another terminal while loading KDE. Description of problem: KDE starts to load, tells me it's checking peripherals, and then the screen goes black. Ctrl-alt-back kills the xserver and gets me out. In running the tail, I discovered that KDE really is runnning OK, but I have to switch to another virtual console (alt-F2) and then ctrl-alt-F7 will get me to the kde desktop. I get error messages from modprobe while kde is loading. It's looking for sound-slot-1, which I think is odd, because modules.conf doesn't say anything about a sound-slot-1. I only have one sound card, and it's at sound-slot-0. I tried turning off the sound server in the kde control center, and that didn't help. I also get gpm error messages when I go in an out of an x-session. Changing GPM_PARAMS in /etc/rc.config to the correct type of mouse helped get rid of flaky mouse behavior in console, but the error messages continue. Below are the messages. Any ideas or suggestions are appreciated. Thanks, Greg Oct 12 13:54:29 linux gpm[1601]: Error in protocol Oct 12 13:55:04 linux last message repeated 38 times Oct 12 13:55:05 linux modprobe: modprobe: Can't locate module sound-slot-1 Oct 12 13:55:05 linux modprobe: modprobe: Can't locate module sound-service-1-0 Oct 12 13:55:05 linux modprobe: modprobe: Can't locate module sound-slot-1 Oct 12 13:55:05 linux modprobe: modprobe: Can't locate module sound-service-1-0 Oct 12 13:55:05 linux modprobe: modprobe: Can't locate module sound-slot-1 Oct 12 13:55:05 linux modprobe: modprobe: Can't locate module sound-service-1-0 Oct 12 13:55:05 linux modprobe: modprobe: Can't locate module sound-slot-1 Oct 12 13:55:05 linux modprobe: modprobe: Can't locate module sound-service-1-0

Oct. 12, 2003

Re: [Wlug] NIC settings -- how?

by David Goss

Hi all... hope someone can help... been away from the meetings for a while... ( like a year ) due to health reasons... then to boot my linux machine had a massive failure and i had to replace it... had it all set up the forward and masquerade a couple of windows boxes through my dsl connection... ( verizon ) have the pppoe all set up... but can't for the life of me remember how to set up the ipchains to handle the windows boxes for the wife and kids... and man they are getting hostile about not being able to get on the internet from home... i know it was not that hard to set up but for the life of me i can not find the docs i used in the first place... hoping to make some meetings soon... now that the health is getting back to "normal"... and buying beer for the helpful guy that can get my network back to normal as well... best regards to all dave goss

Oct. 11, 2003

Re: [Wlug] NIC settings -- how?

by Charles R. Anderson

On Thu, Oct 09, 2003 at 01:18:34PM -0400, Bill Mills-Curran wrote: > How can I view and alter NIC settings, like auto-negotiate, speed, > duplex on my Red Hat 8/9 boxes? mii-tool or ethtool, depending on the driver. -- Charles R. Anderson <cra(a)wpi.edu> / http://angus.ind.wpi.edu/~cra/ PGP Key ID: 49BB5886 Fingerprint: EBA3 A106 7C93 FA07 8E15 3AC2 C367 A0F9 49BB 5886

Oct. 9, 2003

NIC settings -- how?

by Bill Mills-Curran

How can I view and alter NIC settings, like auto-negotiate, speed, duplex on my Red Hat 8/9 boxes? Thanks, Bill

Oct. 9, 2003

Re: Old Hardware (Re: Re: Debian question)

by Bob George

"Chuck Homic" <chuck(a)vvisions.com> wrote: > [...] > Currently it is an excuse to own the domain underpowered.net. Hah, great name! > [...] > - How can I get on this list? That sounds cool. Info is at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/survpc/ . Be forewarned however: It's an often contentious place, with a few hard-core DOS holdouts. Not all that it could be, but success stories for using "old stuff" are always welcome. > - I chose Debian for three reasons. 1. familiarity, 2. laziness, 3. the > aforementioned 240M hard drive. Since Debian would install a working > base system in around 50M, I figured it could conserve well. That's why I wound up on Debian, although with a *bit* more disk space! > Currently > I'm running DNS, HTTP, FTP, & IMAP with ~100M free for data. I have to > erase the HTTP logs of virus attacks on a fairly regular basis to keep > that free space, though. ;) Great to hear that it keeps up with all that. A few folks on the list have asked about using various distributions on limited hardware, and I've generally recommended Debian as worth considering. I've installed it on 486en, but usually with 32M or more memory. I wasn't sure about less being practical (recogizing practical depends on the individual). > - In retrospect, it would be nice to have a package manager with more > modest RAM requirements. However, I'll decide this for real when I > install the second hard drive. With one HD just for swap, it might not > matter so much. Are you using dpkg or apt? > - I have no problem saturating my 10Mbit ethernet with a 486-25, so I'm > sure it would make a fine firewall/gateway if you don't use it for > anything else, and you might have to go easy on the firewall rules. Or > it might do fine with fancy firewall rules, who knows? Experience > running NAT (for a T1) on similar hardware indicates that that would be > no problem. I did notice that old NE2000 clone NICs caused my CPU utilization to spike, especially ISA versions. My 486-66 did fine with PCI cards, though that was a couple of kernels ago. > - Although installing packages is a pain (which would be fixed up for > $0.50 of RAM, I presume) it just hums along in the interim. I don't > know how much RAM the motherboard can take, and I wouldn't know who to > buy 30/72-pin SIMMs from. :) Although experience shows I wouldn't have > to buy them, they would be given to me if I express interest. (That's a > big bonus for old hardware! Hmm. If I didn't toss 'em before the big move, I might actually HAVE some 4M 30 pin SIMMs. I think I'm out of 72 pin though. I get sad thinking about what I had to toss in Phoenix due to no time prior to my move. I did give away a couple of trunkloads of old stuff. > [...] > - It's a good box just to have hooked up to a wire, but if you have such a > thing and you ever find yourself thinking about adding a second 486 to > boost resources, you've gone off the deep end. After the novelty value > subsides, you have to think about the energy cost. How many services > can you provide per watt? How would that compare to a 50W power supply > on an old P-100 thinkpad or something? Yeah, I finally started consolidating boxes. A real problem in Phoenix was heat, where my "den" easily ran 10 degrees hotter than the rest of the house. 'Course, here that's not quite the issue it was. Still, I don't like waste, and the quiet hum of my current systems is much nicer than the roar of fans I had (as well as the AC working overtime to keep up.) > (I'd often thought about using > aging laptops as servers, to simplify the UPS situation. I figure a > ~$40 car battery plugged into the AC jack could provide backup power for > quite a long time, but that's just insanity.) I wanted to do the same thing! Quiet, low power, and UPS built-in. Oh, and small too. Thanks for the info! - Bob

Oct. 9, 2003

Old Hardware (Re: [Wlug] Re: Debian question)

by Chuck Homic

On Fri, Oct 03, 2003 at 08:31:25AM -0400, Bob George wrote: > "Chuck Homic" <chuck(a)vvisions.com> wrote: > > Oh, hey... my Debian rant reminded me of something! > > > > I have Debian running on a 486-25 with 12MB of RAM. > > [...] > > Hey, mind if I ask what you use it for? The reason I ask is that I'm on a list > dedicated to old PC hardware users, which until recently equated to a base of > fanatical DOS holdouts. Slowly though, most are inquiring about Linux, so I'd > like to give them some useful info about using Debian as a "modern" > distribution on low-resource systems. Unfortunately, I've had to dump most of > my old systems, so can't speak from first-hand experience anymore. Currently it is an excuse to own the domain underpowered.net. It doesn't do much right now, due to lack of storage. My 5G SCSI drive doesn't work with my old old Future Domain controller, so it's running 240M right now. I bought a new interface (urrm... new to me, for a 16-bit ISA SCSI adapter. $1 at eBay, woohoo) and have yet to see if it works better. Anyway, I mostly use it for file transfer, right now. Like if I'm at work and want to send a large file home, I'll drop it there. Or if I want to email friends/family digital photos, but no mail server I know of will accept a 50M attachment, I send a link to http://underpowered.net/whatever In the future I plan to put some of my hackish projects there, expecting that the low bandwidth needs of such things will match the low power available. And of course it runs primary DNS for underpowered.net. > Stephen Darnold, the guy who put Basic Linux together, used to lurk there, and > there was often extensive discussion on what could be run on older hardware. > Yours sounds like the lower end of the spectrum, so I'm wondering how well it > works. Would it work well with Debian specifically as a firewall/gateway? Would > you say the benefits of running something current offsets the inconvenience of > those delays with installs etc.? Whoa, this is like, an interview or something. Let's take it 1-by-1: - How can I get on this list? That sounds cool. - I chose Debian for three reasons. 1. familiarity, 2. laziness, 3. the aforementioned 240M hard drive. Since Debian would install a working base system in around 50M, I figured it could conserve well. Currently I'm running DNS, HTTP, FTP, & IMAP with ~100M free for data. I have to erase the HTTP logs of virus attacks on a fairly regular basis to keep that free space, though. ;) - In retrospect, it would be nice to have a package manager with more modest RAM requirements. However, I'll decide this for real when I install the second hard drive. With one HD just for swap, it might not matter so much. - I have no problem saturating my 10Mbit ethernet with a 486-25, so I'm sure it would make a fine firewall/gateway if you don't use it for anything else, and you might have to go easy on the firewall rules. Or it might do fine with fancy firewall rules, who knows? Experience running NAT (for a T1) on similar hardware indicates that that would be no problem. - Although installing packages is a pain (which would be fixed up for $0.50 of RAM, I presume) it just hums along in the interim. I don't know how much RAM the motherboard can take, and I wouldn't know who to buy 30/72-pin SIMMs from. :) Although experience shows I wouldn't have to buy them, they would be given to me if I express interest. (That's a big bonus for old hardware! That's how I got my 5M SCSI drive... it's one of those big full-height Seagate bricks, and fits in no modern case known to man.) - It's a good box just to have hooked up to a wire, but if you have such a thing and you ever find yourself thinking about adding a second 486 to boost resources, you've gone off the deep end. After the novelty value subsides, you have to think about the energy cost. How many services can you provide per watt? How would that compare to a 50W power supply on an old P-100 thinkpad or something? (I'd often thought about using aging laptops as servers, to simplify the UPS situation. I figure a ~$40 car battery plugged into the AC jack could provide backup power for quite a long time, but that's just insanity.) Well, enough rambling. Work to do. -Chuck BTW, speaking of old hardware... some folks on the list might remember my '87 Plymouth Sundance. My brother put in a new engine, and it now runs like da shiznit, and is approaching 210,000 miles. You don't get free parts for a 15 year old car like a 15 year old computer, but there are other advantages.

Oct. 9, 2003

shameless promo of Slackware by the DistroWatch guy..

by Brian McLinden

DistroWatch Weekly, Issue 17, 29 September 2003 (opinion piece article by Ladislav Bodnar, the man who runs DW itself) "A new stable version of Slackware Linux was released late on Friday. As usual, the news was greeted with plenty of enthusiasm by many die-hard Slackware fans and by much curiosity from users of other distributions. What is so special about Slackware? Unlike other commercial distribution makers, such as Red Hat, Mandrake or SuSE, Slackware doesn't come with any system administration tools, it has an amazingly unsophisticated package manager and the company rarely makes headlines in the Linux media. Yet every a new Slackware release is announced, a wave of excitement sweeps the Linux forums and new sites (this OSNews review is a good example). Slackware is to Linux distributions what vi is to UNIX text editors - many people expected vi to die after an abundance of new, more intuitive and user-friendly text editors were introduced. But instead, vi flourished. And while other Linux distributions have certainly managed to take market share away from Slackware, there are still plenty of people out there -- probably a lot more than many would led you believe -- who would never consider using anything else. If you've never tried Slackware before, give it a partition now - and be prepared to fall in love... [end of comment]" Question - does he like slack because it is more like unix than any other distro? Back in the days when men were men............... __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search http://shopping.yahoo.com

Oct. 9, 2003

Re: [Wlug] I choose Slackware.. God help me! (And you guys, please?)

by Matt Higgins

Woops miss fire!! Let me get to answering your questions. 1. simple is not easy? Well this is debatable. Think simple and it mostly easy, think hard and it is always hard! Your first step to easy, is to build a command line vocabulary and familiarize yourself with a command line editor (vi,vim,emacs,etc..) the choice of which is as much philosophical as it is functional. To get you started I would recommend a few books. I love getting documentation on-line but I feel much closer to paper and ink then I do electron guns and liquid crystals, not to mention you will not have Internet access right off the bat. Learning the Unix Operating System, 5th Edition: http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/lunix5/chapter/index.html Running Linux, 4th Edition: http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/runux4/ vi Editor Pocket Reference: http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/vipr/ These all just happen to be O'Reilly books these came right off the top of my head. The Learning the Unix OS book is a great place to start! It has examples and exercises and teaches you all the basic commands you will need to navigate the file system and start editing files. These will be your 1st tools and will also be the basis for learning other commands. Further more you can get started with these books before you get your system. 2. Partitions: The vendor should layout the disk in a reasonable way. If you want to leave some free space for the testing of alternative distributions tell them to leave 10GB free, that should be enough to install a few distros and not leave you strapped for space. As for the physical layout of the data on the disk, you realistically can't control this. The IDE controller will translate the physical layout of the disk into what amounts to one contiguous block. To say that file "foo" is on platter 3 and close the the spindle is almost impossible. Further more the file system will do its best to allocate blocks contiguously and fill in unused space in the most efficient way it knows how. I am not sure how the vendor will ultimately install everything, but the link you sent leads me to a high-end Linux workstation co. they may mirror the two IDE drives leaving you with md0-n and not the traditional hd[a-z][0-n]. File system layout is a big long topic something you will learn after reading the Running Linux book. For now trust the vendor and scorn them later when you are done reading. 3. Internet: You address 2 different points here. I will start with on-line-help. Slackware will come with ton's of documentation. This is often considered on-line even if its not on the Internet. There are docs for most installed applications in /usr/share/docs and there are man pages for just about everything else. You will learn about man in the Learning Unix book. Note that man pages are like legal documents, at first they are difficult to read but once you choke down a few you get the hang of it. Do you have dial up or do you have DSL? The two are a bit different with respect to configuration. I believe there is a section for configuring both in the Running Linux book. 4 Printer: I would recommend using the cups printer daemon. It replaces the old lp/lpd/lpr progs and has a much better configuration. There are scores of drivers, including ones for the latest printers. If it is not installed by default there is a package available. Cups supports almost all HP printers deskJet and laserJet. Wow that was a mouthful, I hope this ans most of your questions. Talk you soon.. Matt

Oct. 8, 2003

Re: [Wlug] I choose Slackware.. God help me! (And you guys, please?)

by Matt Higgins

Brian, Great post! Pleas excuse me for my lack of poetic sensablility throught this response. Fisrt I would like to commend you on your choice of Slackware, a fantastic distrobution with a lot to offer and wonderfull history.

Oct. 8, 2003

I choose Slackware.. God help me! (And you guys, please?)

by Brian McLinden

That�s why I hope to meet guys into slack. Tomorrow night�s meeting? The email below is about my climb in life and the three technical things foremost in my concerns. If you�re not into slack, there�s no need to continue reading. tks, Brian - - - - - - - - - - - - - I'm a newbie with just a little Fortran experience and a 1 gig HDD machine with Windows 98 and no printer either! Nonetheless I�m feeling the need to choose Slackware 9.1. It�s because I�ve read a bit of craft obligation and personal challenge in the following: �Slackware is Linux's oldest living distribution. It does not try to emulate Windows, it tries to be as Unix-like as possible. It does not try to cover up processes with fancy, point-and-click GUIs(Graphical User Interfaces). Instead, it puts users in control by letting them see exactly what's going on. Slackware is for people who enjoy learning and tweaking their system to do exactly what they want. Slackware's stability and simplicity is why people will continue to use it for years to come.� But simple does not mean easy, does it? Back in the days when men were Men........... I�m up in years (you�ll know me when you see I�m fat, ugly, and bald with white hair), but in my day I made 5 violins under a master (before life took me somewhere else). The only power tool I used was a band saw to cut smaller pieces out of a split log. You can make a violin out of very few knives, chisels, scrapers, and a block plane. I made my own patterns, knives, and scrapers. I had never worked wood before, even by power tools. (I never had had interest in those.) Those early instruments were slow going and not a little agony, but I knew with control of the hand and discipline of the heart that I could step up in my work, and take it to the level of art, well beyond anyone skilled with power tools. Am I a bit competitive and still trying to be a man�s man? Anyhow, I believe you see the parallel. I want to get to command line and not rely at an emotional level on commercial distributions what with all *their* packaging schemes (read: complications) and *their* bloatware GUI�s. It�s a bit about control and pride, isn�t it? How else can I bypass the Windows mentality and hope to step up in open source as a craft? I want to be a thinker and doer in this game, not just a consumer or user of various Distributions. My goal longer term is art, not just sitting at the feet of documented Authority. Another parallel: how can you design a Cadillac with no skills to build a model T Ford? Man or not, I�m scared! At the least I�m feeling a little shaky, and here�s why. Switching back to the violin story, I knew how to make those knives out of straight razors and scrapers out of blue shim stock. I could sharpen on my own the blade of a block plane until no one could see the edge. It was intuitive and it wasn�t rocket science. It took no prior reading or class instruction. I put in plenty of sweat time at the bench. It took me eight days (no kidding) to cut my first bass bar to a perfect fit, and I never backed off once from the challenge. Of course I knew my master was back there, watching. I did not quit while seeing him work at ten times my rate. My pride would not let me give up. But there came a time when I could go no further without my master�s help. Art was not possible without the ultimacy and intimacy of oral tradition. Thank God for newsgroups and the WLUG. It takes a community to raise a boy to manhood. So learning slackware, as learning unix in the old days, must require a combination of self-reliance AND guru help. In life we must settle for no false choices. Three items below. As background, I�m about ready to place an order for a stripped down machine with two IDE drives and Slackware. (Forget all that talk last week about SCSI, I don�t need bragging rights or a hardware �screamer.� Because, as you must know by now, the �screaming� I�m experiencing now has nothing whatever to do with any hardware.) 1. Partitions. I�m new to Linux, but trying to learn, so please don�t shoot me. What should my (various?) slack files look like? I have never seen any. I don�t know what to look for. Specifically, what partitioning specs can I give to the vendor who will pre-install and configure slack for me so that I have a working machine? I would like to be able to read and learn from these files BEFORE the iron arrives on my desk. I would like to split my slack partitions over two 80G disks for speed of random access. Thus, taking platter construction into account, the most frequently used partitions should be in the physical center of each disk. I would like to put slack primarily on hda, and, later on, any second distribution (Mandrake? Libranet? new Debian when it comes out?) primarily on hdb. What detailed partitioning do you recommend upfront to permit or pave the way for this control and flexibility? 2. Internet. auuggh..! Here, a problem of the chicken/egg variety. What should my slack files look like for dial-up access (to start with my current Prodigy) and DSL access (Speakeasy later when I�m ready to try downloads)? Unless I have these things up and running, I won�t be able to interface with online Linux help! 3. Printer. Anyone have a reliable model number for a Linux printer to suggest? Nothing fancy, just something to print out docs for Linux study in the woods, and an occasional letter. What should my slack files look like? (Of course I don�t know a thing yet about driver stuff..) These three are my foremost technical concerns that seem to be holding me back from my first flight. I hope to receive you hand up on these things! Biggest thing of all, the opportunity to meet you tomorrow night and chat over pizza. until then, Brian __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search http://shopping.yahoo.com

Oct. 8, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Picking a distro (was: 1st posting: Worcester ISP? Distros? LAC?)

by Bill Smith

Le Fri, 3 Oct 2003 09:43:09 -0400, « "John Stoffel" <stoffel(a)lucent.com> » a écrit: JS> RedHat 9 isn't that attractive, mostly because I've been using JS> RedHat since 5.2 and I want to change and try to stay away from JS> GNOME since it's a slow pig resource wise. I also want to get JS> updated in terms of GTK so I can run newer GNOME apps, like Gramps JS> 0.9.4. I've been using RH9 on my laptop (Gateway 9100 Solo, pII/266) for some time now. I use Window Maker as my window manager, so that I have the advantage(s) of Gnome libraries (if there are any) and the speed of a descent manager.... Gnome will run on this beastie, but it's a bit sluggish. 8( Personally, I don't see much of a reason to avoid RH9. if resources are an issue, just make sure you use a WM with a small footprint (like Window Maker or others like it), or even avoid X altogether if you really feel the need to run your toes through the sand. <shrug> I've discovered yum for package management, but i am only now beginning to play with it. it sounds like a better way to deal with packages than up2date (for RH systems). i know next to nothing about apt, even though I understand that it has been "ported" for use on RH. Best regards, -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- William Smith wsmith-at-chezsmith-dot-com Fall River, MA http://www.chezsmith.com "L'homme c'est rien -- l'oeuvre c'est tout." -- Gustave Flaubert * TAG! v3.1 *

Oct. 7, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Picking a distro (was: 1st posting: Worcester ISP? Distros? LAC?)

by John Stoffel

Matt> I may get jeers for promoting BSD on a Linux list but if you Matt> want good package management with dependency checks the only way Matt> to go these days is *BSD ports tree. My forward facing boxen all Matt> run OpenBSD. I run FreeBSD on my one co-lo box that's facing the public directly. Mostly because I know the *BSD distros are quite secure out of the box, and because I wanted to learn their foibles. So far, it's been working well, with only one problem, when someone found out I had an open ftp server and filled my disk with crap. I nuked it and shutdown the ftp server and all has been fine since. >> I originally came from a BSD style init background, which I liked >> quite alot, then moved to the SYSV style of /etc/rc#.d/... which I >> hated at first. But after thinking it through, it's a much much >> better way to do things. It lets you manage application and daemon >> startup in a clean and consistent manner, without having to watch out >> for other packages nearly as much. Matt> I agree that the old way is just that old! I clearly see the Matt> utility in using the sysV init its much more flexible, but if Matt> you are just running a desktop and starting a small number of Matt> services the old way is just fine. Further more Slackware Matt> provides support for the new way as well. I still thank that the SYSV init setup (which is just as old as BSD stuff!) is better all around, even for a desktop. I also believe that there's little difference between a desktop and a server, except for how they are used and the extent they are used. But since I manage systems for a living in a development environment, I have a different perspective than someone who's just using a system at home. Matt> Amiga sweet! I always wanted an Amiga, I had a C64 and C128. I had an Amiga 1000 (bought the first month they were available) and then an Amiga 2500. Finally got rid of the last in the mid 90's when I realized that Linux/Intel was the way to go. Matt> When you do make your decition tell us what you chose and why ? Matt> It would be interesting to read. Of course I hope you chose Matt> Slackware! Well, so far I've been playing with Debian and getting it going. I admit it's been a pain since it doesn't want to detect my ethernet card out of the box, so it defaults to only offering PPP for connection to the internet. And since I have a Matrox G450 with an HP A4331D monitor (21", 1280x1024), it's been a friggin pain and won't give me a proper setup. Mostly I think it's really a kernel issue, since I *hate* using modules for most stuff. I generally compile all the core stuff I need into my kernel so it's there from the get go. The default debian kernel is modular and not workign well with X for some reason. I'll fix it soon enough... and I did make it boot up with a 2.4.18 kernel from the start, thanks to whomever gave the -24bf hint. I may still punt and goto RH9 to see how well it does, but I'm slowing coming to like how Debian works. It's not perfect, but apt-get is kinda addictive. Though it's got quirks that annoy me too. So, the next big issue is determining how I can mirror my entire root disk and still boot of either half of the mirror properly. It's a pair of 18gb SCSI disks, with a pair of 120gb IDE drives for /home and /usr/local sometime down the line. Now to get the SCSI drive(s) setup with RAID on boot. John

Oct. 6, 2003

Re: What mix of distros to learn with? Please evaluate..

by Bob George

"Brian McLinden" <blm987(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > Newbie here. I am purchasing a system to learn Linux with by multi-booting. [...] Brian, To what end? Are you interested on a personal geek-toy level, or do you see this as a career enhancment? Are you most interested in ease-of-use and features for end-users, or as a network/system administrator? Do you want to develop software, or stricly use end-user apps? Each distribution has relative strenghts and weaknesses in each of these areas. If yuo're trying to replace your Windows desktop, you'll have different priorities than if you're trying to learn "Enterprise" systems support. > [...] > I want to learn with diverse systems that are easy to modify/reconfigure/ > maintain/upgrade after the box arrives. Would you say this a good mix of > distros fo initial learning purposes, or would you suggest I consider another > mix or approach--and why? I would second Matt's recommendations to pick one first (few are "bad"), and get familiar with it before going all-out. I started with RedHat as my first serious Linux distribution, then, after I understood why I didn't like some RedHat conventions, had a much better idea of what I really wanted. I finally settled on Debian, but the bulk of the RedHat experience still applied. - Bob

Oct. 6, 2003

REMINDER: Upcoming meeting Thursday Oct 9th

by Andy Stewart

Hi everybody, Our next WLUG meeting is coming up soon. This e-mail is a friendly reminder of that fact. This meeting will be held in a totally new location on the WPI Campus in Worcester, MA USA. The location is called the "Access Grid" room, and it is located in the "lower wedge" of Morgan Hall. Detailed directions appear on the recently updated WLUG website. I'll try to post a few of my penguin signs to guide you. I'm told that this room has some great projection equipment and can hold approx. 20-25 people without a problem. At this meeting, Doug Waud will talk about and demonstrate some genealogical Linux software called Lifelines. As I don't expect this to take the entire duration of the meeting, I'll also bring my laptop and demonstrate XFce version 4, a lightweight desktop for Linux. In addition, I was asked to spend a few minutes describing a couple of commands for the new Linux users of the group. We can also explore the capabilities of the new meeting room and make plans for its use at future meetings. After the meeting, we'll go out for pizza and beer at the Boynton Restaurant. See ya later! Andy -- Andy Stewart, Founder Worcester Linux Users' Group Worcester, MA USA http://www.wlug.org

Oct. 6, 2003

Re: [Wlug] What mix of distros to learn with? Please evaluate..

by Walt Sawyer

I use Red Hat version 9. With the execption of a couple of screen savers giving me trouble, I have found it to be stable and easy to use. I signed up on the Red Hat Network for $60./year and the updates are easily installed before the news is released. I bought the distro at a computer show last April, and installed it on a box with a P2 cpu, 128mB RAM, 6gig HD. It's slow sometimes (like with a big job from the GIMP), but for the most part, I have been satisfied with it. Walt [image] [image] [image] Walt Sawyer wsawyer(a)norfolk-county.com On Sat, 2003-10-04 at 08:57, Matt Higgins wrote: > Brian, > > > I would start by getting used to one distro before venturing out. If you are not > familiar with Linux/UNIX at all there will be a steep learning curve before you > build up your command line vocabulary. With that said I think RH is a great > starter distro. The installer is one of the best, and for someone new to Linux > rpm's are the best way to get you where you want fast (rpmfind is your friend). > > Matt > > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug >

Oct. 5, 2003

Re: Old hardware

by doug waud

Hi all When I first saw that "Old Hardware" juxtaposed to "Keith Wright" I thought I should point out I am still older. And isn't the term "wetware"? Keith Wright wrote: > You're my kind of guy. This would maybe be better as a reply > to someone else, but I'de rather talk to someone who doesn't > think 12Mb of RAM is too small to bother with. Keith, I have always wondered how much memory you have on your abacus. I am always amazed you can get emacs to run on it! :-) doug

Oct. 4, 2003

Re: [Wlug] what size/speed combo to use for a dual SCSI system?

by Matt Higgins

Brian, If you are just using this as a workstation the SCSI disks may be a bit of overkill. Don't get me wrong large reads will be fast but for the most part you will be working in a shell, vi/emacs, browsing the web, etc.. none of these operations are disk intensive. If you are interested in data integrity you could save your self a few hundred bucks and get 2 120GB IDE disks put them on different channels and use Linux to do a software mirror. RH9 will allow you to set this up at install time. If you are interested in general speed improvement I would look at bus and cpu clocks with a focus on the ram bus. It sounds like you have money to spend, you may also want to look at an SATA Intel 865 board. This board offers dual channel DDR RAM slots, SATA and regular ATA, go with the 3GHz HT cpu. Looks like any way you go you will have a screamer! Matt

Oct. 4, 2003

Re: [Wlug] what size/speed combo to use for a dual SCSI system?

by Andy Stewart

On Saturday 04 October 2003 7:57 am, Brian McLinden wrote: > Hello -- I'm new here, and hoping to meet many of you soon! > > I want to multi-boot and play with three distros for a machine that would > most likely always be a workstation, not a server. It would be for > numerical work and not involve large or many audio or video files. > > It happens that the smaller the SCSI drive, the better the performance, and > of course the smallest, fastest sizes available for SCSI are 18G and 32G. > > I'm planning to buy a matched pair of drives in order to spread the > partitions for each distro across the two drives. > > Two questions: > > 1. I'd like to use use 2x18, but in your opinion, do I need 2x32? HI Brian, I admire your zeal ! :-) I run SCSI drives in my systems at home. It is true that SCSI drives have better performance at higher cost relative to IDE. It is also true that a drive spinning at 10-15K rpms has an acoustic quality which my ears don't like. I don't think most people need 18 GB of disk space, but that's what is sold today. Folks who consume large amounts of disk space are typically saving alot of videos, mp3s, and pictures. > 2. Do you think 15000 rpm will be noticeably snappier than 10000 rpm? For your purposes, probably not. In a server environment with a large number of users, most definitely. Save a few bucks and get the U160 drives as they are trying to sell those off to make room for the (new) U320 drives. Your SCSI controller would be cheaper, too, if you did that. Later, Andy -- Andy Stewart, Founder Worcester Linux Users' Group Worcester, MA USA http://www.wlug.org

Oct. 4, 2003

Re: [Wlug] What mix of distros to learn with? Please evaluate..

by Andy Stewart

On Saturday 04 October 2003 7:27 am, Brian McLinden wrote: > Hi all, > > Newbie here. I am purchasing a system to learn Linux with by multi-booting. > The three distros I'm thinking of having the vendor pre-install are: > > - Slackware 9.1 > - Libranet 2.8.1 (a commercial Debian from Canada) > - some RPM approach (which of RH, Suse, or Mandrake would you > go with? why?) > > I want to learn with diverse systems that are easy to modify/reconfigure/ > maintain/upgrade after the box arrives. Would you say this a good mix of > distros fo initial learning purposes, or would you suggest I consider > another mix or approach--and why? Hi Brian, I happen to like SuSE Linux. It is an RPM based distribution which comes on 7 CDs and 1 DVD for approx. $75 for the professional edition. It has its own graphical system administration tool called YaST. I find it easy to install and operate. The company is based in Germany and SuSE is a top distribution in that part of the world. Version 9.0 is coming out near the end of October. It occurs to me that having 3 distros installed simultaneously on a computer is a bit unusual. There would have to be alot of disk partitions to support this (a minimum of 7, one shared swap, 3xboot/root). As a newbie, be careful of this, as it is complexity not normally seen. Later, Andy -- Andy Stewart, Founder Worcester Linux Users' Group Worcester, MA USA http://www.wlug.org

Oct. 4, 2003

Re: [Wlug] What mix of distros to learn with? Please evaluate..

by Matt Higgins

Brian, I would start by getting used to one distro before venturing out. If you are not familiar with Linux/UNIX at all there will be a steep learning curve before you build up your command line vocabulary. With that said I think RH is a great starter distro. The installer is one of the best, and for someone new to Linux rpm's are the best way to get you where you want fast (rpmfind is your friend). Matt

Oct. 4, 2003

what size/speed combo to use for a dual SCSI system?

by Brian McLinden

Hello -- I'm new here, and hoping to meet many of you soon! I want to multi-boot and play with three distros for a machine that would most likely always be a workstation, not a server. It would be for numerical work and not involve large or many audio or video files. It happens that the smaller the SCSI drive, the better the performance, and of course the smallest, fastest sizes available for SCSI are 18G and 32G. I'm planning to buy a matched pair of drives in order to spread the partitions for each distro across the two drives. Two questions: 1. I'd like to use use 2x18, but in your opinion, do I need 2x32? 2. Do you think 15000 rpm will be noticeably snappier than 10000 rpm? Thanks all, Brian 752-3033 anytime __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month! http://sbc.yahoo.com

Oct. 4, 2003

What mix of distros to learn with? Please evaluate..

by Brian McLinden

Hi all, Newbie here. I am purchasing a system to learn Linux with by multi-booting. The three distros I'm thinking of having the vendor pre-install are: - Slackware 9.1 - Libranet 2.8.1 (a commercial Debian from Canada) - some RPM approach (which of RH, Suse, or Mandrake would you go with? why?) I want to learn with diverse systems that are easy to modify/reconfigure/ maintain/upgrade after the box arrives. Would you say this a good mix of distros fo initial learning purposes, or would you suggest I consider another mix or approach--and why? Thank you all, Brian __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search http://shopping.yahoo.com

Oct. 4, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Picking a distro (was: 1st posting: Worcester ISP? Distros? LAC?)

by Matt Higgins

> Thanks for your comments Matt, you make alot of good points, though I > must admit that having a package management system without > dependencies isn't an ideal state of affairs. Of course, having > dependencies which you can't override is also not a good thing > either. :] I may get jeers for promoting BSD on a Linux list but if you want good package management with dependency checks the only way to go these days is *BSD ports tree. My forward facing boxen all run OpenBSD. When I need an update I simply run cvs upd; make; make install. Granted these ports trees are limited in size and you may have trouble getting Gramps to compile but it works. If you have a box ripe for a packet filter or file server you may want to give one the *BSD's a try. > > I originally came from a BSD style init background, which I liked > quite alot, then moved to the SYSV style of /etc/rc#.d/... which I > hated at first. But after thinking it through, it's a much much > better way to do things. It lets you manage application and daemon > startup in a clean and consistent manner, without having to watch out > for other packages nearly as much. I agree that the old way is just that old! I clearly see the utility in using the sysV init its much more flexible, but if you are just running a desktop and starting a small number of services the old way is just fine. Further more Slackware provides support for the new way as well. > > I also remember getting a copy of Slackware way back in 93 or so, but > since I had an Amiga back then, I was never able to play with it and > test it out. I probably missed the boat back then. *grin* Amiga sweet! I always wanted an Amiga, I had a C64 and C128. > > Thanks to all who have contributed, it's been a good discussion. > > John When you do make your decition tell us what you chose and why ? It would be interesting to read. Of course I hope you chose Slackware! > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > >

Oct. 3, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Picking a distro (was: 1st posting: Worcester ISP? Distros? LAC?)

by John Stoffel

Matt> Slackware is my distro of choice. I am a sysadmin recently turn Matt> developer and find Slackware to be a very complete package. Thanks for your comments Matt, you make alot of good points, though I must admit that having a package management system without dependencies isn't an ideal state of affairs. Of course, having dependencies which you can't override is also not a good thing either. :] I originally came from a BSD style init background, which I liked quite alot, then moved to the SYSV style of /etc/rc#.d/... which I hated at first. But after thinking it through, it's a much much better way to do things. It lets you manage application and daemon startup in a clean and consistent manner, without having to watch out for other packages nearly as much. I also remember getting a copy of Slackware way back in 93 or so, but since I had an Amiga back then, I was never able to play with it and test it out. I probably missed the boat back then. *grin* Thanks to all who have contributed, it's been a good discussion. John

Oct. 3, 2003

RE: [Wlug] Foxtrot cartoon in Worcester T&G

by Karl Hiramoto

http://www.ucomics.com/foxtrot/index.phtml On Fri, 3 Oct 2003, Simoncini, Matthew wrote: > Sorry if you don't accept attachments: > > <<...OLE_Obj...>> > > Matthew > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Keith Wright [mailto:kwright@free-comp-shop.com] > > Sent: Friday, October 03, 2003 3:40 PM > > To: Worcester Linux User's Group > > Subject: [Wlug] Foxtrot cartoon in Worcester T&G > > > > > > Or any where else you can find it. > > > > It goes like: > > > > Large blackboard, small boy, stern teacher: > > > > Blackboard: > > #include <stdio.h> > > int main(void) > > { int k; > > for (k=1;k<=500;k++) > > printf("I will not throw paper airplanes in class"); > > return(0); > > } > > > > Boy: Holds chalk. > > > > Teacher: Nice try. > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wlug mailing list > > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > -- ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø Karl Hiramoto <karl(a)hiramoto.org> Work: 978-425-2090 ext 25 Cell: 508-517-4819 http://karl.hiramoto.org/ AOL IM ID = KarlH420 Yahoo_IM = karl_hiramoto ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø Q: How can you tell when a Burroughs salesman is lying? A: When his lips move.

Oct. 3, 2003

RE: [Wlug] Foxtrot cartoon in Worcester T&G

by Simoncini, Matthew

Sorry if you don't accept attachments: <<...OLE_Obj...>> Matthew > -----Original Message----- > From: Keith Wright [mailto:kwright@free-comp-shop.com] > Sent: Friday, October 03, 2003 3:40 PM > To: Worcester Linux User's Group > Subject: [Wlug] Foxtrot cartoon in Worcester T&G > > > Or any where else you can find it. > > It goes like: > > Large blackboard, small boy, stern teacher: > > Blackboard: > #include <stdio.h> > int main(void) > { int k; > for (k=1;k<=500;k++) > printf("I will not throw paper airplanes in class"); > return(0); > } > > Boy: Holds chalk. > > Teacher: Nice try. > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug >

Oct. 3, 2003

Foxtrot cartoon in Worcester T&G

by Keith Wright

Or any where else you can find it. It goes like: Large blackboard, small boy, stern teacher: Blackboard: #include <stdio.h> int main(void) { int k; for (k=1;k<=500;k++) printf("I will not throw paper airplanes in class"); return(0); } Boy: Holds chalk. Teacher: Nice try.

Oct. 3, 2003

Re: Old hardware (Re: [Wlug] Re: Debian question)

by Keith Wright

> From: Karl Hiramoto <karl(a)zoop.org> > > > for the last few years. I've been running a 486SX-25 with 8M RAM and > 100M HD here at my work as a print server. I rescued the box from a > pile of garbage. I'm running slackware 3.6 with a 2.0.39 kernel > though. Just setup samba and lpd to do the printing. The machine has > excellent reliability. > > These old boxes work fine for print servers, routers, firewalls, > > Old machines work great to for automation of real world things. Set a > voltage, read a voltage, set bit, clear bit control applications. You're my kind of guy. This would maybe be better as a reply to someone else, but I'de rather talk to someone who doesn't think 12Mb of RAM is too small to bother with. To those thinking of upgrading old hardware to a newer RedHat: Although I can't find any documentation of the fact anywhere, (the 'hardware requirements' section of the manual talks about disk space but not RAM), I know from hard experience that RH9.0 flatly refuses to install on 32MB and works only after giving you some backtalk on 64MB. It says something like "You lamer, if you won't give me a better machine, I'm going to turn on swapping bfore installing a boot sector, and trash anything you might have had on this disk. Then maybe I'll reboot". Why can't kids these days copy a 12K file in less than 16M? I don't know, but suspect that it has to do with making the install process "easier" by sending a human wave at it. Now nobody can say Overwrite partition table (y/n)? without first installing the X window, GtK, CORBA, Qt, Python, and Perl. -- Keith

Oct. 3, 2003

Re: Old hardware (Re: [Wlug] Re: Debian question)

by gboyce＠badbelly.com

Old boxes are great for low CPU jobs, as long as you don't take it too far. Eventually, even machines that run fine for their purposes can be a drain on resources. I've been trying to get my girlfriend's dad to retire this box for a while now: exponent:~$ cat /proc/cpuinfo processor : 0 cpu : 386 model : unknown vendor_id : unknown stepping : unknown fdiv_bug : no hlt_bug : no f00f_bug : no fpu : yes fpu_exception : no cpuid : no wp : no flags : bogomips : 4.39 exponent:~$ free -m total used free shared buffers cached Mem: 6 6 0 4 0 2 -/+ buffers: 3 3 Swap: 34 2 32 GCC/Glibc/other utilities and libraries are so old on this thing that cross compiling for it is difficult at best, and building large packages directly on it take forever. These days, you can get low end pentium's for cheap and/or free, so there's no real point in keeping 386/486 machines around except for the geek factor of it. On Fri, 3 Oct 2003, Karl Hiramoto wrote: > for the last few years. I've been running a 486SX-25 with 8M RAM and > 100M HD here at my work as a print server. I rescued the box from a > pile of garbage. I'm running slackware 3.6 with a 2.0.39 kernel > though. Just setup samba and lpd to do the printing. The machine has > excellent reliability. > > These old boxes work fine for print servers, routers, firewalls, > > Old machines work great to for automation of real world things. Set a > voltage, read a voltage, set bit, clear bit control applications. > > here is the box: > #df > Filesystem 1024-blocks Used Available Capacity Mounted on > /dev/hda2 97271 83435 8813 90% / > > # cat /proc/cpuinfo > processor : 0 > cpu : 486 > model : Cx486 > vendor_id : CyrixInstead > stepping : unknown, core/bus clock ratio: unknownx > fdiv_bug : no > hlt_bug : no > f00f_bug : no > fpu : no > fpu_exception : no > cpuid : no > wp : yes > flags : > bogomips : 4.71 > > # free > total used free shared buffers > cached > Mem: 6684 6300 384 4500 1960 > 2200 > -/+ buffers/cache: 2140 4544 > Swap: 16432 536 15896 > > >

Oct. 3, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Picking a distro (was: 1st posting: Worcester ISP? Distros? LAC?)

by Matt Higgins

Slackware is my distro of choice. I am a sysadmin recently turn developer and find Slackware to be a very complete package. Some note able points are that its tgz packages are quite simple. There is no dependency checking built into them which is good for me because I like to build some things and rpm/tgz others and I am not stuck with only using the package manager to install software when I need an update. Slackware also comes with a tool to convert rpms to tgz so you can grab your fav rpms and install them on your Slackware box as tgz's. In production env's I have always exported /usr/local and managed pages with stow. Being a sysadmin the 1st place I go to on any distro is the etc dir. Slackware uses old style bsd rc scripts for startup which are all well documented and easy to read. You can also use the more recent sys V init.d if you chose. Network config is also done through the rc.d init scripts and they are all well documented with examples and comments. I find this much cleaner then the nasty poorly documented /etc/sysconfig/* mess you see with RedHat that requires the use of a set of broken Python scripts to manage it. They also use a nice rc script to manage module loading as well so you will never get screwed when modutils changes its format or reads a new config file which it has done at every major Linux release i.e. 2.2, 2.4 and now 2.6. The installer is dated compared to the likes of many graphical installs but it does the job just fine. It is not nearly as painful as the Debian installer. But no where near as good as RH. The latest version of Slackware 9.1 which I recently installed on my laptop has all the features and support you see in every other major distro with a few extras. 9.1 comes with the 2.4.22, jdk(I am a Java guy), 2.6 kernel ready(this means updated modutils etc..), GNOME 2.4, (not your favorite desktop but it has become much more responsive and less memory intensive with this release), XFce, WindowMaker, etc... You can chose resier or ext2/3 at install and supports xfs and jfs. Latest GTK. No need to update ssh yet! as it ships w/ the latest. So thats my Slackware advertisement. To be fair there are advantages and disadvantage to any distro and if you are out to try something new give Slackware a try. Matt

Oct. 3, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Picking a distro

by Josh Huber

"John Stoffel" <stoffel(a)lucent.com> writes: > I like apt too so far, but searching for packages seems to have been > a bit painful. That is until I learned about the -a flag to > apt-show-versions, but since I haven't read my about the apt-get > philosophy, I've probably just missed something. Your problem is you are not using apt-cache. apt-cache search <keyword> <keyword> ... ...will search package names and descriptions for all available packages. apt-cache show <package> will show the description for any available package, and other information (dependencies, etc) After you've used it a couple times, you'll really like it :) > Josh> Use the bf2.4 installer -- it will install a 2.4 kernel by > Josh> default. > > Hmmm... any examples? Is this part of the 3.0 CDROM image? According to the manual, CD 5 boots the bf2.4 image. Do you have the official cdroms, or your own? You should be able to find a netinst image online as well. (minimal cdrom installer, which expect to install the rest of the system from the internet) Here are netinst images for testing: http://gluck.debian.org/cdimage/testing/netinst/ -- Josh Huber

Oct. 3, 2003

Passwd/shadow problem with RH 7.X

by dibb_jim＠emc.com

I've resurrected a linux box that had RH7.something installed, current kernel is 2.8.18. Anyway, the user accounts (all one of them) I had setup before work fine. I can't for the life of me add a new one though, because the password doesn't seem to be getting handled correctly. When I do 'useradd -g mailer -p test mynewuser', an entry ends up in /etc/shadow that looks like mynewuser:test:...... In other words the cleartext password is in the shadow file. I can't change it or log in. If I specify no password (no -p) it doesn't work either. I've run the pwconv program, nothing seems to help. Any clues? I played with this for two hours and couldn't make any sense of it. I did find an article on line where someone had the same symptoms and pwconv fixed it, but I can't make it work. Thanks. Jim - lurker for years, but hope to contribute more.

Oct. 3, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Picking a distro (was: 1st posting: Worcester ISP? Distros? LAC?)

by John Stoffel

Charles> Well, Red Hat 9 meets all your requirements above, except the Charles> one that says you don't want Red Hat :) You didn't give any Charles> good reason why you wanted to stay away from Red Hat other Charles> than you "want to change try to stay away from GNOME". Well, Charles> Red Hat 9 has KDE too, and you can always get WindowMaker, Charles> Blackbox, Fluxbox, XFCE, or something else if you want a Charles> ligher weight GUI. http://freshrpms.net/ is a good place to Charles> find such addons. Well, part of it has been that I've been using it for so long, it seems like I should try something new and see how that goes. Another issue is that I haven't been wild about some of the system configuration tools they provide, but it's not a big deal. I dunno, it's more of an urge to do something else, not a true desire to move off. Also, I have noticed that alot of packages are still staying with 7.3 or 8, and that 9 hasn't seemed to be as popular. Hard to tell... Charles> The Red Hat Linux distro that we all know an love <g> is Charles> turning into the Fedora Core community supported and Charles> developed distro. Its direction, shape, package selection, Charles> etc. will be very much driven by what the community wants. Charles> In this way, it will be more like the Debian Project, which I Charles> believe will alleviate some of the reservations people may Charles> have had about using Red Hat in the past. E.g. WindowMaker Charles> and those other GUIs will be able to come back into the Charles> distro if the community desires it. Charles> Fedora Core will also support apt-get, yum, and up2date with Charles> third party repositories of software. This will include Charles> Fedora Core itself, updates, Fedora Extras, Fedora Charles> Alternatives, and Fedora Legacy (for those who want an older, Charles> more stable distro to be supported for a longer time). See Charles> http://fedora.redhat.com/ for more info about the project. But none of this exists right now, and I want to rebuild my system this weekend if I can. :] Of course, nothing says I can't play with this stuff later one. Also, some of the rpmbuild and rpm commands have really ticked me off, since I consider the syntax and errors messages to be really baroque and unhelpful. Especially when trying to build a SRPM package, and it dies for no frigging obvious reason. And since I'm planning a fresh install, I've got the Debian and RH9 disks to play with. So maybe I'll just go with Debian for now and see how it goes long term. Thanks for the input. John

Oct. 3, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Picking a distro

by John Stoffel

Josh> Anything in particular? Just curious. I suspect I'm one of Josh> those people who is really used to how APT works, so I like it a Josh> lot. I like apt too so far, but searching for packages seems to have been a bit painful. That is until I learned about the -a flag to apt-show-versions, but since I haven't read my about the apt-get philosophy, I've probably just missed something. Josh> Are you not aware of the apt-cache command? Nope, nor have I used it. Josh> Use the bf2.4 installer -- it will install a 2.4 kernel by Josh> default. Hmmm... any examples? Is this part of the 3.0 CDROM image? Josh> Well, I would recommend using Debian/unstable (unless testing Josh> has new enough packages for you), if you want to play with the Josh> newest software. I may be biased, however, :) I'm leaning towards debian unstable, if only because apt-get has been useful and simple once I've learned more about it. John

Oct. 3, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Picking a distro

by Josh Huber

"John Stoffel" <stoffel(a)lucent.com> writes: > I've been playing with Debian 3.0 (stable -> unstable -> testing > (for XFree86 4.3)) on a laptop, and while I like apt, and how well > it does for getting packages and setting them up, it's not perfect > either. Part of that might just be getting used to how it works, > and of course used to how apt works. Anything in particular? Just curious. I suspect I'm one of those people who is really used to how APT works, so I like it a lot. > Finding packages can be a pain at times... Are you not aware of the apt-cache command? > and I'm annoyed it installs a 2.2.x kernel by default. They're > slipping behind the times I feel. Use the bf2.4 installer -- it will install a 2.4 kernel by default. > [snip stuff about using the latest software] > So, what do you all think is the next best distro to go with now? Well, I would recommend using Debian/unstable (unless testing has new enough packages for you), if you want to play with the newest software. I may be biased, however, :) -- Josh Huber

Oct. 3, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Picking a distro (was: 1st posting: Worcester ISP? Distros? LAC?)

by Charles R. Anderson

On Fri, Oct 03, 2003 at 09:43:09AM -0400, John Stoffel wrote: stoffel> So, what do you all think is the next best distro to go with now? Well, Red Hat 9 meets all your requirements above, except the one that says you don't want Red Hat :) You didn't give any good reason why you wanted to stay away from Red Hat other than you "want to change try to stay away from GNOME". Well, Red Hat 9 has KDE too, and you can always get WindowMaker, Blackbox, Fluxbox, XFCE, or something else if you want a ligher weight GUI. http://freshrpms.net/ is a good place to find such addons. The Red Hat Linux distro that we all know an love <g> is turning into the Fedora Core community supported and developed distro. Its direction, shape, package selection, etc. will be very much driven by what the community wants. In this way, it will be more like the Debian Project, which I believe will alleviate some of the reservations people may have had about using Red Hat in the past. E.g. WindowMaker and those other GUIs will be able to come back into the distro if the community desires it. Fedora Core will also support apt-get, yum, and up2date with third party repositories of software. This will include Fedora Core itself, updates, Fedora Extras, Fedora Alternatives, and Fedora Legacy (for those who want an older, more stable distro to be supported for a longer time). See http://fedora.redhat.com/ for more info about the project. -- Charles R. Anderson <cra(a)wpi.edu> / http://angus.ind.wpi.edu/~cra/ PGP Key ID: 49BB5886 Fingerprint: EBA3 A106 7C93 FA07 8E15 3AC2 C367 A0F9 49BB 5886

Oct. 3, 2003

Old hardware (Re: [Wlug] Re: Debian question)

by Karl Hiramoto

for the last few years. I've been running a 486SX-25 with 8M RAM and 100M HD here at my work as a print server. I rescued the box from a pile of garbage. I'm running slackware 3.6 with a 2.0.39 kernel though. Just setup samba and lpd to do the printing. The machine has excellent reliability. These old boxes work fine for print servers, routers, firewalls, Old machines work great to for automation of real world things. Set a voltage, read a voltage, set bit, clear bit control applications. here is the box: #df Filesystem 1024-blocks Used Available Capacity Mounted on /dev/hda2 97271 83435 8813 90% / # cat /proc/cpuinfo processor : 0 cpu : 486 model : Cx486 vendor_id : CyrixInstead stepping : unknown, core/bus clock ratio: unknownx fdiv_bug : no hlt_bug : no f00f_bug : no fpu : no fpu_exception : no cpuid : no wp : yes flags : bogomips : 4.71 # free total used free shared buffers cached Mem: 6684 6300 384 4500 1960 2200 -/+ buffers/cache: 2140 4544 Swap: 16432 536 15896 On Fri, 3 Oct 2003, Bob George wrote: > "Chuck Homic" <chuck(a)vvisions.com> wrote: > > Oh, hey... my Debian rant reminded me of something! > > > > I have Debian running on a 486-25 with 12MB of RAM. > > [...] > > Hey, mind if I ask what you use it for? The reason I ask is that I'm on a list > dedicated to old PC hardware users, which until recently equated to a base of > fanatical DOS holdouts. Slowly though, most are inquiring about Linux, so I'd > like to give them some useful info about using Debian as a "modern" > distribution on low-resource systems. Unfortunately, I've had to dump most of > my old systems, so can't speak from first-hand experience anymore. > > Stephen Darnold, the guy who put Basic Linux together, used to lurk there, and > there was often extensive discussion on what could be run on older hardware. > Yours sounds like the lower end of the spectrum, so I'm wondering how well it > works. Would it work well with Debian specifically as a firewall/gateway? Would > you say the benefits of running something current offsets the inconvenience of > those delays with installs etc.? > > Thanks, > > - Bob > > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > -- ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø Karl Hiramoto <karl(a)hiramoto.org> Work: 978-425-2090 ext 25 Cell: 508-517-4819 http://karl.hiramoto.org/ AOL IM ID = KarlH420 Yahoo_IM = karl_hiramoto ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø And they shall beat their swords into plowshares, for if you hit a man with a plowshare, he's going to know he's been hit.

Oct. 3, 2003

(OT) HP 49G graphing calculator

by Karl Hiramoto

Sorry a litte off topic, but i'm guessing there are some engineers on here who might like the HP cacluators. I'm looking for someplace local to buy a HP49G calculator. I need it fast, so i can't order online. Anyone have ideas? thanks -- ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø Karl Hiramoto <karl(a)hiramoto.org> Work: 978-425-2090 ext 25 Cell: 508-517-4819 http://karl.hiramoto.org/ AOL IM ID = KarlH420 Yahoo_IM = karl_hiramoto ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø And they shall beat their swords into plowshares, for if you hit a man with a plowshare, he's going to know he's been hit.

Oct. 3, 2003

Picking a distro (was: 1st posting: Worcester ISP? Distros? LAC?)

by John Stoffel

Hi all, I'm in the fun position of trying to figure out how I want to upgrade my main home system. It's a heavily patched and hacked together RedHat 7.2 system. I've not got a new pair of 120gb drives for /home and /usr/local (will be mirrored) and I'm ready to upgrade... but to what? As a professional SysAdmin, I'm not afraid of doing stuff by hand and hacking of stuff. As a dad of a 14 month old, I don't have time! *grin* So I'm hoping to start up a fruitful discussion here to see what other people have done in this type of situation. RedHat 9 isn't that attractive, mostly because I've been using RedHat since 5.2 and I want to change and try to stay away from GNOME since it's a slow pig resource wise. I also want to get updated in terms of GTK so I can run newer GNOME apps, like Gramps 0.9.4. I've been playing with Debian 3.0 (stable -> unstable -> testing (for XFree86 4.3)) on a laptop, and while I like apt, and how well it does for getting packages and setting them up, it's not perfect either. Part of that might just be getting used to how it works, and of course used to how apt works. Finding packages can be a pain at times... and I'm annoyed it installs a 2.2.x kernel by default. They're slipping behind the times I feel. I've also played with Gentoo about six months or so ago. Nice idea, I like the idea of emerge sync (apt-get update for debian folks) but it was also a bit crufty, though not horribly so. Maybe it's better now. I think I used 1.4rc1 or something like that. My main issue is that I want good support for my Matrox G450, USB doohickys (256mb SanDisk memory stick, CompactFlash card reader, etc), sound card (I have CS3236 builtin ISA sound, or ALS4000 PCI), and good LVM/DM support. Oh yeah, the latest libraries so I can run the latest packages like Gnumeric, OpenOffice (1.1 is nice!), etc. My RH 7.2 base is getting way too old. I'm happy to also compile and test kernels on here from time to time as well, just to try and contribute to the kernel developement with trouble reports and some hacking to keep old cards going. So, what do you all think is the next best distro to go with now? John

Oct. 3, 2003

Re: Debian question

by Bob George

"Chuck Homic" <chuck(a)vvisions.com> wrote: > Oh, hey... my Debian rant reminded me of something! > > I have Debian running on a 486-25 with 12MB of RAM. > [...] Hey, mind if I ask what you use it for? The reason I ask is that I'm on a list dedicated to old PC hardware users, which until recently equated to a base of fanatical DOS holdouts. Slowly though, most are inquiring about Linux, so I'd like to give them some useful info about using Debian as a "modern" distribution on low-resource systems. Unfortunately, I've had to dump most of my old systems, so can't speak from first-hand experience anymore. Stephen Darnold, the guy who put Basic Linux together, used to lurk there, and there was often extensive discussion on what could be run on older hardware. Yours sounds like the lower end of the spectrum, so I'm wondering how well it works. Would it work well with Debian specifically as a firewall/gateway? Would you say the benefits of running something current offsets the inconvenience of those delays with installs etc.? Thanks, - Bob

Oct. 3, 2003

Debian question

by Chuck Homic

Oh, hey... my Debian rant reminded me of something! I have Debian running on a 486-25 with 12MB of RAM. (Pause for laughter...) Okay. Now then. When I run dpkg (on its own, or via apt-get) it wants about 18M of RAM to work with. This causes a fair deal of thrashing, and if I just let it go, it takes about 30 minutes to install even the most basic package. My solution thus far is to use the NBD driver to mount a swap space over the network. This is actually faster because the swap and actual package install don't have to contend for precious HDD seek time, and I can install the most basic packages in about 10 minutes or so. Even so, it would be nice if it were a bit faster still. Anyone know what dpkg does with its RAM? Is it loading all the packges into memory to figure out dependencies and stuff? Any way to make it behave more efficiently? -Chuck

Oct. 3, 2003

Re: [Wlug] 1st posting: Worcester ISP? Distros? LAC?

by Chuck Homic

On Thu, Oct 02, 2003 at 09:57:58AM -0400, Gregory Avedissian wrote: > My experience with Debian 3.0 - > > The installer is archaic. First, you have to put in all four disks to be > read. Then you get to select a base package, then you get to fill in > more selections from a list of everything. You can use the arrow keys to > scroll up and down the list of over a thousand packages and the space [...] Ah, someone who hasn't learned the secret of dselect: Don't use it. :) To install debian, go and burn the bootable CD ISO image. After it installs the base system and launches dselect, find the key that exits immediately (I think it's 'x') and press it. (If you don't have access to a CD writer, you can put the base system on your FAT partition, and use the single boot floppy to access it.) You now have a bootable system with networking support. And you've done the hard part. From here on out, if you want anything just use "apt-get" (My first choice is usually "apt-get less" and other rediculously basic packages. Then, "apt-get x-window-system" which is an adventure and a half.) I like this method so much, because you have a system with only exactly what you want and nothing more. Which is good if your hard disk is 240M. But, of course there's a certain personality required to like Debian, because it certainly does nothing for you except install stuff with all its dependencies. Which is all I want in a distro to begin with. -Chuck

Oct. 3, 2003

Re: [Wlug] mail disaster recovery - success

by Richard Goodman

Many thanks, looks like the mail server backup is operational. The first two pieces of incoming mail after the fix were spam to invalid addresses at the domain, but they were properly queued by the backup server in mqueue. Anything special about getting the mail out when my home DSL (and server) come back up in a few days. I was thinking of possibly moving the queued mail to a temporary directory a few times a day to cut down on needless retries before the DSL is restored. Any thoughts? Dick At 03:57 PM 10/2/2003 -0400, you wrote: >sorry, > >the local-host-names file should be empty.. >only the access file should have RELAY. > >it is trying to recive mail on your host, but the accounts dont exist >on that box. > > >On Thu, 2 Oct 2003, Richard Goodman wrote: > > > After 1-1/2 hours studying Oreilly/Sendmail & Oreilly/DNS&Bind, I stumbled > > upon the correct format for my MX records ... turns out they were all > wrong > > on a dozen domains on four servers. > > > > Now I have a new problem ... with the MX records working, the backup > server > > is starting to receive mail, but rejecting it all for "Unknown user" ... I > > thought the mail was to be queued for redelivery, not attempted to deliver > > to mailboxes on the backup server. What have I done wrong NOW? > > > > Dick > > > > At 02:04 PM 10/2/2003 -0400, you wrote: > > > > >you got 0 answer for your MX. your DNS is misconfigured. > > > > > >dig -t mx domain.com > > > > > >should in your case display at least 2 answers. your main server, and > > >your backup server > > > > > >for example: > > >dig -t mx wlug.org > > > > > >; <<>> DiG 9.2.1 <<>> -t mx wlug.org > > >;; global options: printcmd > > >;; Got answer: > > >;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 63144 > > >;; flags: qr rd ra; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 2, AUTHORITY: 3, ADDITIONAL: 0 > > > > > >;; QUESTION SECTION: > > >;wlug.org. IN MX > > > > > >;; ANSWER SECTION: > > >wlug.org. 259200 IN MX 20 mx.WPI.EDU. > > >wlug.org. 259200 IN MX 10 smtp.WPI.EDU. > > > > > >;; AUTHORITY SECTION: > > >wlug.org. 259200 IN NS ns1.wlug.org. > > >wlug.org. 259200 IN NS alum.WPI.EDU. > > >wlug.org. 259200 IN NS > > >dns1.dovetailinternet.net. > > > > > >;; Query time: 110 msec > > >;; SERVER: 192.168.2.48#53(192.168.2.48) > > >;; WHEN: Thu Oct 2 14:02:48 2003 > > >;; MSG SIZE rcvd: 149 > > > > > > > > > > > >You might need to set your secondary DNS to be a master for your > > >domain. remember to restart the named. > > > > > > > > >On Thu, 2 Oct 2003, Richard Goodman wrote: > > > > > > > ; <<>> DiG 9.2.1 <<>> -t MX mydomain.net > > > > ;; global options: printcmd > > > > ;; Got answer: > > > > ;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 3412 > > > > ;; flags: qr rd ra; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 0, AUTHORITY: 1, ADDITIONAL: 0 > > > > > > > > ;; QUESTION SECTION: > > > > ;mydomain.net. IN MX > > > > > > > > ;; AUTHORITY SECTION: > > > > mydomain.net. 2924 IN SOA mydomain.net. > > > > rlg.bach.mydomain. > > > > net. 2003100202 10800 3600 604800 3600 > > > > > > > > ;; Query time: 7 msec > > > > ;; SERVER: 67.100.202.xxx#53(67.100.202.xxx) > > > > ;; WHEN: Thu Oct 2 13:47:15 2003 > > > > ;; MSG SIZE rcvd: 75 > > > > > > > > I'd already gotten that output but didn't see any MX output, just the > > > question. > > > > Your interpretation? Further suggestions? I'm losing mail at this > point, > > > > but would like to stop the hemorraging. The SOA serial# indicates > it is > > > the > > > > most recent version of the modified (secondary) DNS > > > > > > > > Dick > > > > > > > > At 01:37 PM 10/2/2003 -0400, you wrote: > > > > > > > > >do a: > > > > >dig -t MX domain.com > > > > > > > > > >should show you if the DNS is reporting the backup mail sever > > > > >correctly. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >On Thu, 2 Oct 2003, Richard Goodman wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Karl, > > > > > > That was exactly what I was looking for. > > > > > > Did the local-host-names changes; I already had the RELAY lines in > > > access > > > > > > on the backup machine. > > > > > > Since the primary DNS is on the down IP address, I modified the > > > secondary > > > > > > (slave) DNS which is one of my office boxes by adding a second > MX line: > > > > > > > > > > > > my-host MX 99 temp.server.domain. <--dot at end > > > > > > and restarted that named. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Its been quite a while and I'm not seeing any mail queueing, > and I know > > > > > > there's mail that should be coming in on a regular basis. What else > > > > > might I > > > > > > have missed? > > > > > > > > > > > > What can I use (nslookup, dig ? with what parameters) to see > > > whether the > > > > > > MX lines are right? When I send a test email from an off-site > > > machine, the > > > > > > sending sendmail log says "Connection timed out" and shows the > down IP > > > > > address. > > > > > > > > > > > > Dick > > > > > > > > > > > > At 03:52 PM 10/1/2003 -0400, you wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > >on the backup RH mail box: > > > > > > >add you domain to the backup /etc/mail/local-host-names and > set it > > > > > > >to relay in /etc/mail/access > > > > > > > > > > > > > >type make in the /etc/mail/ directory and restart sendmail. > > > > > > > > > > > > > >you can try testing it. send mail to your domian. also, > could telnet > > > > > > >to mailserver.com 25 and put SMTP comands to verify it is > accepting > > > > > > >mail for that domain. > > > > > > > > > > > > > >when it is buffering the mail, it should show up in > /var/spool/mail > > > > > > > > > > > > > >if your home DSL is going to be down for some time, you might just > > > > > > >want to bring the box into the office, and point the DNS > directly at > > > > > > >it, if you can. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >On Wed, 1 Oct 2003, Richard Goodman wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My home DSL has been down for over 48 hours and it appears > that it > > > > > will be > > > > > > > > down for several more days. (I spare you the gory details). > I am > > > > > concerned > > > > > > > > about losing mail coming into various domains at that site. > > > > > > > > That RH 7.3 machine runs mail/web/primary DNS for those > domains. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have modified the secondary DNS records for those > domains (on a > > > > > machine > > > > > > > > at my office - also on DSL) with an higher cost MX record > > > pointing to a > > > > > > > > machine at the office also running RH 7.3 and sendmail, > which I > > > assume > > > > > > > will > > > > > > > > pick up and queue the mail. The DNS TTLs are reasonably short, > > > > > fortunately. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I've done this following O'Reilly/Sendmail book 2nd > edition, but > > > > > its not > > > > > > > > always crystal clear if you don't already understand > it! Is there > > > > > > > anything > > > > > > > > else I have to do on the backup machine (pointed to by the > new MX > > > > > > > records), > > > > > > > > particularly is there anything I have to do to its sendmail > config > > > > > files? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Any other pointers or "gotcha"s to this whole process? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dick > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Wlug mailing list > > > > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > > > > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > > > > > > > > >-- > > > > > >¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø > > >Karl Hiramoto <karl(a)hiramoto.org> > > >Work: 978-425-2090 ext 25 > > >Cell: 508-517-4819 > > >http://karl.hiramoto.org/ > > >AOL IM ID = KarlH420 Yahoo_IM = karl_hiramoto > > >¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø > > > > > >People are always available for work in the past tense. > > > > > > > > >_______________________________________________ > > >Wlug mailing list > > >Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > > >http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wlug mailing list > > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > > >-- > >¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø >Karl Hiramoto <karl(a)hiramoto.org> >Work: 978-425-2090 ext 25 >Cell: 508-517-4819 >http://karl.hiramoto.org/ >AOL IM ID = KarlH420 Yahoo_IM = karl_hiramoto >¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø > >Beggar to well-dressed businessman: > "Could you spare $20.95 for a fifth of Chivas?" > > >_______________________________________________ >Wlug mailing list >Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org >http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug

Oct. 2, 2003

Re: [Wlug] mail disaster recovery

by Karl Hiramoto

sorry, the local-host-names file should be empty.. only the access file should have RELAY. it is trying to recive mail on your host, but the accounts dont exist on that box. On Thu, 2 Oct 2003, Richard Goodman wrote: > After 1-1/2 hours studying Oreilly/Sendmail & Oreilly/DNS&Bind, I stumbled > upon the correct format for my MX records ... turns out they were all wrong > on a dozen domains on four servers. > > Now I have a new problem ... with the MX records working, the backup server > is starting to receive mail, but rejecting it all for "Unknown user" ... I > thought the mail was to be queued for redelivery, not attempted to deliver > to mailboxes on the backup server. What have I done wrong NOW? > > Dick > > At 02:04 PM 10/2/2003 -0400, you wrote: > > >you got 0 answer for your MX. your DNS is misconfigured. > > > >dig -t mx domain.com > > > >should in your case display at least 2 answers. your main server, and > >your backup server > > > >for example: > >dig -t mx wlug.org > > > >; <<>> DiG 9.2.1 <<>> -t mx wlug.org > >;; global options: printcmd > >;; Got answer: > >;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 63144 > >;; flags: qr rd ra; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 2, AUTHORITY: 3, ADDITIONAL: 0 > > > >;; QUESTION SECTION: > >;wlug.org. IN MX > > > >;; ANSWER SECTION: > >wlug.org. 259200 IN MX 20 mx.WPI.EDU. > >wlug.org. 259200 IN MX 10 smtp.WPI.EDU. > > > >;; AUTHORITY SECTION: > >wlug.org. 259200 IN NS ns1.wlug.org. > >wlug.org. 259200 IN NS alum.WPI.EDU. > >wlug.org. 259200 IN NS > >dns1.dovetailinternet.net. > > > >;; Query time: 110 msec > >;; SERVER: 192.168.2.48#53(192.168.2.48) > >;; WHEN: Thu Oct 2 14:02:48 2003 > >;; MSG SIZE rcvd: 149 > > > > > > > >You might need to set your secondary DNS to be a master for your > >domain. remember to restart the named. > > > > > >On Thu, 2 Oct 2003, Richard Goodman wrote: > > > > > ; <<>> DiG 9.2.1 <<>> -t MX mydomain.net > > > ;; global options: printcmd > > > ;; Got answer: > > > ;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 3412 > > > ;; flags: qr rd ra; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 0, AUTHORITY: 1, ADDITIONAL: 0 > > > > > > ;; QUESTION SECTION: > > > ;mydomain.net. IN MX > > > > > > ;; AUTHORITY SECTION: > > > mydomain.net. 2924 IN SOA mydomain.net. > > > rlg.bach.mydomain. > > > net. 2003100202 10800 3600 604800 3600 > > > > > > ;; Query time: 7 msec > > > ;; SERVER: 67.100.202.xxx#53(67.100.202.xxx) > > > ;; WHEN: Thu Oct 2 13:47:15 2003 > > > ;; MSG SIZE rcvd: 75 > > > > > > I'd already gotten that output but didn't see any MX output, just the > > question. > > > Your interpretation? Further suggestions? I'm losing mail at this point, > > > but would like to stop the hemorraging. The SOA serial# indicates it is > > the > > > most recent version of the modified (secondary) DNS > > > > > > Dick > > > > > > At 01:37 PM 10/2/2003 -0400, you wrote: > > > > > > >do a: > > > >dig -t MX domain.com > > > > > > > >should show you if the DNS is reporting the backup mail sever > > > >correctly. > > > > > > > > > > > >On Thu, 2 Oct 2003, Richard Goodman wrote: > > > > > > > > > Karl, > > > > > That was exactly what I was looking for. > > > > > Did the local-host-names changes; I already had the RELAY lines in > > access > > > > > on the backup machine. > > > > > Since the primary DNS is on the down IP address, I modified the > > secondary > > > > > (slave) DNS which is one of my office boxes by adding a second MX line: > > > > > > > > > > my-host MX 99 temp.server.domain. <--dot at end > > > > > and restarted that named. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Its been quite a while and I'm not seeing any mail queueing, and I know > > > > > there's mail that should be coming in on a regular basis. What else > > > > might I > > > > > have missed? > > > > > > > > > > What can I use (nslookup, dig ? with what parameters) to see > > whether the > > > > > MX lines are right? When I send a test email from an off-site > > machine, the > > > > > sending sendmail log says "Connection timed out" and shows the down IP > > > > address. > > > > > > > > > > Dick > > > > > > > > > > At 03:52 PM 10/1/2003 -0400, you wrote: > > > > > > > > > > >on the backup RH mail box: > > > > > >add you domain to the backup /etc/mail/local-host-names and set it > > > > > >to relay in /etc/mail/access > > > > > > > > > > > >type make in the /etc/mail/ directory and restart sendmail. > > > > > > > > > > > >you can try testing it. send mail to your domian. also, could telnet > > > > > >to mailserver.com 25 and put SMTP comands to verify it is accepting > > > > > >mail for that domain. > > > > > > > > > > > >when it is buffering the mail, it should show up in /var/spool/mail > > > > > > > > > > > >if your home DSL is going to be down for some time, you might just > > > > > >want to bring the box into the office, and point the DNS directly at > > > > > >it, if you can. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >On Wed, 1 Oct 2003, Richard Goodman wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > My home DSL has been down for over 48 hours and it appears that it > > > > will be > > > > > > > down for several more days. (I spare you the gory details). I am > > > > concerned > > > > > > > about losing mail coming into various domains at that site. > > > > > > > That RH 7.3 machine runs mail/web/primary DNS for those domains. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have modified the secondary DNS records for those domains (on a > > > > machine > > > > > > > at my office - also on DSL) with an higher cost MX record > > pointing to a > > > > > > > machine at the office also running RH 7.3 and sendmail, which I > > assume > > > > > > will > > > > > > > pick up and queue the mail. The DNS TTLs are reasonably short, > > > > fortunately. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I've done this following O'Reilly/Sendmail book 2nd edition, but > > > > its not > > > > > > > always crystal clear if you don't already understand it! Is there > > > > > > anything > > > > > > > else I have to do on the backup machine (pointed to by the new MX > > > > > > records), > > > > > > > particularly is there anything I have to do to its sendmail config > > > > files? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Any other pointers or "gotcha"s to this whole process? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dick > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Wlug mailing list > > > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > > > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > > > > > >-- > > > >¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø > >Karl Hiramoto <karl(a)hiramoto.org> > >Work: 978-425-2090 ext 25 > >Cell: 508-517-4819 > >http://karl.hiramoto.org/ > >AOL IM ID = KarlH420 Yahoo_IM = karl_hiramoto > >¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø > > > >People are always available for work in the past tense. > > > > > >_______________________________________________ > >Wlug mailing list > >Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > >http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > -- ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø Karl Hiramoto <karl(a)hiramoto.org> Work: 978-425-2090 ext 25 Cell: 508-517-4819 http://karl.hiramoto.org/ AOL IM ID = KarlH420 Yahoo_IM = karl_hiramoto ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø Beggar to well-dressed businessman: "Could you spare $20.95 for a fifth of Chivas?"

Oct. 2, 2003

Re: [Wlug] mail disaster recovery

by Richard Goodman

After 1-1/2 hours studying Oreilly/Sendmail & Oreilly/DNS&Bind, I stumbled upon the correct format for my MX records ... turns out they were all wrong on a dozen domains on four servers. Now I have a new problem ... with the MX records working, the backup server is starting to receive mail, but rejecting it all for "Unknown user" ... I thought the mail was to be queued for redelivery, not attempted to deliver to mailboxes on the backup server. What have I done wrong NOW? Dick At 02:04 PM 10/2/2003 -0400, you wrote: >you got 0 answer for your MX. your DNS is misconfigured. > >dig -t mx domain.com > >should in your case display at least 2 answers. your main server, and >your backup server > >for example: >dig -t mx wlug.org > >; <<>> DiG 9.2.1 <<>> -t mx wlug.org >;; global options: printcmd >;; Got answer: >;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 63144 >;; flags: qr rd ra; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 2, AUTHORITY: 3, ADDITIONAL: 0 > >;; QUESTION SECTION: >;wlug.org. IN MX > >;; ANSWER SECTION: >wlug.org. 259200 IN MX 20 mx.WPI.EDU. >wlug.org. 259200 IN MX 10 smtp.WPI.EDU. > >;; AUTHORITY SECTION: >wlug.org. 259200 IN NS ns1.wlug.org. >wlug.org. 259200 IN NS alum.WPI.EDU. >wlug.org. 259200 IN NS >dns1.dovetailinternet.net. > >;; Query time: 110 msec >;; SERVER: 192.168.2.48#53(192.168.2.48) >;; WHEN: Thu Oct 2 14:02:48 2003 >;; MSG SIZE rcvd: 149 > > > >You might need to set your secondary DNS to be a master for your >domain. remember to restart the named. > > >On Thu, 2 Oct 2003, Richard Goodman wrote: > > > ; <<>> DiG 9.2.1 <<>> -t MX mydomain.net > > ;; global options: printcmd > > ;; Got answer: > > ;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 3412 > > ;; flags: qr rd ra; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 0, AUTHORITY: 1, ADDITIONAL: 0 > > > > ;; QUESTION SECTION: > > ;mydomain.net. IN MX > > > > ;; AUTHORITY SECTION: > > mydomain.net. 2924 IN SOA mydomain.net. > > rlg.bach.mydomain. > > net. 2003100202 10800 3600 604800 3600 > > > > ;; Query time: 7 msec > > ;; SERVER: 67.100.202.xxx#53(67.100.202.xxx) > > ;; WHEN: Thu Oct 2 13:47:15 2003 > > ;; MSG SIZE rcvd: 75 > > > > I'd already gotten that output but didn't see any MX output, just the > question. > > Your interpretation? Further suggestions? I'm losing mail at this point, > > but would like to stop the hemorraging. The SOA serial# indicates it is > the > > most recent version of the modified (secondary) DNS > > > > Dick > > > > At 01:37 PM 10/2/2003 -0400, you wrote: > > > > >do a: > > >dig -t MX domain.com > > > > > >should show you if the DNS is reporting the backup mail sever > > >correctly. > > > > > > > > >On Thu, 2 Oct 2003, Richard Goodman wrote: > > > > > > > Karl, > > > > That was exactly what I was looking for. > > > > Did the local-host-names changes; I already had the RELAY lines in > access > > > > on the backup machine. > > > > Since the primary DNS is on the down IP address, I modified the > secondary > > > > (slave) DNS which is one of my office boxes by adding a second MX line: > > > > > > > > my-host MX 99 temp.server.domain. <--dot at end > > > > and restarted that named. > > > > > > > > > > > > Its been quite a while and I'm not seeing any mail queueing, and I know > > > > there's mail that should be coming in on a regular basis. What else > > > might I > > > > have missed? > > > > > > > > What can I use (nslookup, dig ? with what parameters) to see > whether the > > > > MX lines are right? When I send a test email from an off-site > machine, the > > > > sending sendmail log says "Connection timed out" and shows the down IP > > > address. > > > > > > > > Dick > > > > > > > > At 03:52 PM 10/1/2003 -0400, you wrote: > > > > > > > > >on the backup RH mail box: > > > > >add you domain to the backup /etc/mail/local-host-names and set it > > > > >to relay in /etc/mail/access > > > > > > > > > >type make in the /etc/mail/ directory and restart sendmail. > > > > > > > > > >you can try testing it. send mail to your domian. also, could telnet > > > > >to mailserver.com 25 and put SMTP comands to verify it is accepting > > > > >mail for that domain. > > > > > > > > > >when it is buffering the mail, it should show up in /var/spool/mail > > > > > > > > > >if your home DSL is going to be down for some time, you might just > > > > >want to bring the box into the office, and point the DNS directly at > > > > >it, if you can. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >On Wed, 1 Oct 2003, Richard Goodman wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > My home DSL has been down for over 48 hours and it appears that it > > > will be > > > > > > down for several more days. (I spare you the gory details). I am > > > concerned > > > > > > about losing mail coming into various domains at that site. > > > > > > That RH 7.3 machine runs mail/web/primary DNS for those domains. > > > > > > > > > > > > I have modified the secondary DNS records for those domains (on a > > > machine > > > > > > at my office - also on DSL) with an higher cost MX record > pointing to a > > > > > > machine at the office also running RH 7.3 and sendmail, which I > assume > > > > > will > > > > > > pick up and queue the mail. The DNS TTLs are reasonably short, > > > fortunately. > > > > > > > > > > > > I've done this following O'Reilly/Sendmail book 2nd edition, but > > > its not > > > > > > always crystal clear if you don't already understand it! Is there > > > > > anything > > > > > > else I have to do on the backup machine (pointed to by the new MX > > > > > records), > > > > > > particularly is there anything I have to do to its sendmail config > > > files? > > > > > > > > > > > > Any other pointers or "gotcha"s to this whole process? > > > > > > > > > > > > Dick > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wlug mailing list > > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > > >-- > >¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø >Karl Hiramoto <karl(a)hiramoto.org> >Work: 978-425-2090 ext 25 >Cell: 508-517-4819 >http://karl.hiramoto.org/ >AOL IM ID = KarlH420 Yahoo_IM = karl_hiramoto >¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø > >People are always available for work in the past tense. > > >_______________________________________________ >Wlug mailing list >Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org >http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug

Oct. 2, 2003

Re: mail disaster probablity

by Bob George

"Keith Wright" <kwright(a)free-comp-shop.com> wrote: > [...] > Wow! Where did you find mail hosting for $2/mo? I replied earlier that I'm using bmhost.com, which provides SMTP and web hosting. I noticed today that dyndns.org has made some changes (good and bad): Custom DNS WAS $30 one-time, but is now an annual charge. They now can do domain registration for $15/yr. for .com (I may transfer mine). More relevant to this thread, they now offer two mail-related services that might be of interest to those on this list running email servers, but who DON'T have a handy second server available for backup, or whose ISP blocks inbound TCP port 25. Quoting from their web page: --- cut here --- cut here --- MailHopSM Relay allows you to relay incoming mail to a mail server on a non-standard port. This is quite useful for those who want to run a mail server but are stuck with an ISP that blocks port 25, the standard mail port. [...] ($24.95/domain) MailHopSM Backup MX provides a secondary mail server to hold your e-mail for you should your main e-mail server go offline for any reason. Once you go back online, your mail will be delivered to you. Our MailHopSM server will attempt delivery more frequently than most mail servers, and will also hold onto your e-mail for twice as long. ($39.95/domain) --- cut here --- cut here --- Both are more expensive than my cheapie hosting outfit, but do allow you to run a "real" SMTP server if so desired. I'm not affiliated with either bmhost.com or dyndns.org, but am a satisfied customer of both. I just wanted to pass this info on to others experiencing the same challenges running home servers that I have. - Bob

Oct. 2, 2003

Re: [Wlug] mail disaster recovery

by Karl Hiramoto

you got 0 answer for your MX. your DNS is misconfigured. dig -t mx domain.com should in your case display at least 2 answers. your main server, and your backup server for example: dig -t mx wlug.org ; <<>> DiG 9.2.1 <<>> -t mx wlug.org ;; global options: printcmd ;; Got answer: ;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 63144 ;; flags: qr rd ra; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 2, AUTHORITY: 3, ADDITIONAL: 0 ;; QUESTION SECTION: ;wlug.org. IN MX ;; ANSWER SECTION: wlug.org. 259200 IN MX 20 mx.WPI.EDU. wlug.org. 259200 IN MX 10 smtp.WPI.EDU. ;; AUTHORITY SECTION: wlug.org. 259200 IN NS ns1.wlug.org. wlug.org. 259200 IN NS alum.WPI.EDU. wlug.org. 259200 IN NS dns1.dovetailinternet.net. ;; Query time: 110 msec ;; SERVER: 192.168.2.48#53(192.168.2.48) ;; WHEN: Thu Oct 2 14:02:48 2003 ;; MSG SIZE rcvd: 149 You might need to set your secondary DNS to be a master for your domain. remember to restart the named. On Thu, 2 Oct 2003, Richard Goodman wrote: > ; <<>> DiG 9.2.1 <<>> -t MX mydomain.net > ;; global options: printcmd > ;; Got answer: > ;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 3412 > ;; flags: qr rd ra; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 0, AUTHORITY: 1, ADDITIONAL: 0 > > ;; QUESTION SECTION: > ;mydomain.net. IN MX > > ;; AUTHORITY SECTION: > mydomain.net. 2924 IN SOA mydomain.net. > rlg.bach.mydomain. > net. 2003100202 10800 3600 604800 3600 > > ;; Query time: 7 msec > ;; SERVER: 67.100.202.xxx#53(67.100.202.xxx) > ;; WHEN: Thu Oct 2 13:47:15 2003 > ;; MSG SIZE rcvd: 75 > > I'd already gotten that output but didn't see any MX output, just the question. > Your interpretation? Further suggestions? I'm losing mail at this point, > but would like to stop the hemorraging. The SOA serial# indicates it is the > most recent version of the modified (secondary) DNS > > Dick > > At 01:37 PM 10/2/2003 -0400, you wrote: > > >do a: > >dig -t MX domain.com > > > >should show you if the DNS is reporting the backup mail sever > >correctly. > > > > > >On Thu, 2 Oct 2003, Richard Goodman wrote: > > > > > Karl, > > > That was exactly what I was looking for. > > > Did the local-host-names changes; I already had the RELAY lines in access > > > on the backup machine. > > > Since the primary DNS is on the down IP address, I modified the secondary > > > (slave) DNS which is one of my office boxes by adding a second MX line: > > > > > > my-host MX 99 temp.server.domain. <--dot at end > > > and restarted that named. > > > > > > > > > Its been quite a while and I'm not seeing any mail queueing, and I know > > > there's mail that should be coming in on a regular basis. What else > > might I > > > have missed? > > > > > > What can I use (nslookup, dig ? with what parameters) to see whether the > > > MX lines are right? When I send a test email from an off-site machine, the > > > sending sendmail log says "Connection timed out" and shows the down IP > > address. > > > > > > Dick > > > > > > At 03:52 PM 10/1/2003 -0400, you wrote: > > > > > > >on the backup RH mail box: > > > >add you domain to the backup /etc/mail/local-host-names and set it > > > >to relay in /etc/mail/access > > > > > > > >type make in the /etc/mail/ directory and restart sendmail. > > > > > > > >you can try testing it. send mail to your domian. also, could telnet > > > >to mailserver.com 25 and put SMTP comands to verify it is accepting > > > >mail for that domain. > > > > > > > >when it is buffering the mail, it should show up in /var/spool/mail > > > > > > > >if your home DSL is going to be down for some time, you might just > > > >want to bring the box into the office, and point the DNS directly at > > > >it, if you can. > > > > > > > > > > > >On Wed, 1 Oct 2003, Richard Goodman wrote: > > > > > > > > > My home DSL has been down for over 48 hours and it appears that it > > will be > > > > > down for several more days. (I spare you the gory details). I am > > concerned > > > > > about losing mail coming into various domains at that site. > > > > > That RH 7.3 machine runs mail/web/primary DNS for those domains. > > > > > > > > > > I have modified the secondary DNS records for those domains (on a > > machine > > > > > at my office - also on DSL) with an higher cost MX record pointing to a > > > > > machine at the office also running RH 7.3 and sendmail, which I assume > > > > will > > > > > pick up and queue the mail. The DNS TTLs are reasonably short, > > fortunately. > > > > > > > > > > I've done this following O'Reilly/Sendmail book 2nd edition, but > > its not > > > > > always crystal clear if you don't already understand it! Is there > > > > anything > > > > > else I have to do on the backup machine (pointed to by the new MX > > > > records), > > > > > particularly is there anything I have to do to its sendmail config > > files? > > > > > > > > > > Any other pointers or "gotcha"s to this whole process? > > > > > > > > > > Dick > > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > -- ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø Karl Hiramoto <karl(a)hiramoto.org> Work: 978-425-2090 ext 25 Cell: 508-517-4819 http://karl.hiramoto.org/ AOL IM ID = KarlH420 Yahoo_IM = karl_hiramoto ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø People are always available for work in the past tense.

Oct. 2, 2003

Re: [Wlug] mail disaster recovery

by Richard Goodman

; <<>> DiG 9.2.1 <<>> -t MX mydomain.net ;; global options: printcmd ;; Got answer: ;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 3412 ;; flags: qr rd ra; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 0, AUTHORITY: 1, ADDITIONAL: 0 ;; QUESTION SECTION: ;mydomain.net. IN MX ;; AUTHORITY SECTION: mydomain.net. 2924 IN SOA mydomain.net. rlg.bach.mydomain. net. 2003100202 10800 3600 604800 3600 ;; Query time: 7 msec ;; SERVER: 67.100.202.xxx#53(67.100.202.xxx) ;; WHEN: Thu Oct 2 13:47:15 2003 ;; MSG SIZE rcvd: 75 I'd already gotten that output but didn't see any MX output, just the question. Your interpretation? Further suggestions? I'm losing mail at this point, but would like to stop the hemorraging. The SOA serial# indicates it is the most recent version of the modified (secondary) DNS Dick At 01:37 PM 10/2/2003 -0400, you wrote: >do a: >dig -t MX domain.com > >should show you if the DNS is reporting the backup mail sever >correctly. > > >On Thu, 2 Oct 2003, Richard Goodman wrote: > > > Karl, > > That was exactly what I was looking for. > > Did the local-host-names changes; I already had the RELAY lines in access > > on the backup machine. > > Since the primary DNS is on the down IP address, I modified the secondary > > (slave) DNS which is one of my office boxes by adding a second MX line: > > > > my-host MX 99 temp.server.domain. <--dot at end > > and restarted that named. > > > > > > Its been quite a while and I'm not seeing any mail queueing, and I know > > there's mail that should be coming in on a regular basis. What else > might I > > have missed? > > > > What can I use (nslookup, dig ? with what parameters) to see whether the > > MX lines are right? When I send a test email from an off-site machine, the > > sending sendmail log says "Connection timed out" and shows the down IP > address. > > > > Dick > > > > At 03:52 PM 10/1/2003 -0400, you wrote: > > > > >on the backup RH mail box: > > >add you domain to the backup /etc/mail/local-host-names and set it > > >to relay in /etc/mail/access > > > > > >type make in the /etc/mail/ directory and restart sendmail. > > > > > >you can try testing it. send mail to your domian. also, could telnet > > >to mailserver.com 25 and put SMTP comands to verify it is accepting > > >mail for that domain. > > > > > >when it is buffering the mail, it should show up in /var/spool/mail > > > > > >if your home DSL is going to be down for some time, you might just > > >want to bring the box into the office, and point the DNS directly at > > >it, if you can. > > > > > > > > >On Wed, 1 Oct 2003, Richard Goodman wrote: > > > > > > > My home DSL has been down for over 48 hours and it appears that it > will be > > > > down for several more days. (I spare you the gory details). I am > concerned > > > > about losing mail coming into various domains at that site. > > > > That RH 7.3 machine runs mail/web/primary DNS for those domains. > > > > > > > > I have modified the secondary DNS records for those domains (on a > machine > > > > at my office - also on DSL) with an higher cost MX record pointing to a > > > > machine at the office also running RH 7.3 and sendmail, which I assume > > > will > > > > pick up and queue the mail. The DNS TTLs are reasonably short, > fortunately. > > > > > > > > I've done this following O'Reilly/Sendmail book 2nd edition, but > its not > > > > always crystal clear if you don't already understand it! Is there > > > anything > > > > else I have to do on the backup machine (pointed to by the new MX > > > records), > > > > particularly is there anything I have to do to its sendmail config > files? > > > > > > > > Any other pointers or "gotcha"s to this whole process? > > > > > > > > Dick

Oct. 2, 2003

Re: [Wlug] mail disaster recovery

by Karl Hiramoto

do a: dig -t MX domain.com should show you if the DNS is reporting the backup mail sever correctly. On Thu, 2 Oct 2003, Richard Goodman wrote: > Karl, > That was exactly what I was looking for. > Did the local-host-names changes; I already had the RELAY lines in access > on the backup machine. > Since the primary DNS is on the down IP address, I modified the secondary > (slave) DNS which is one of my office boxes by adding a second MX line: > > my-host MX 99 temp.server.domain. <--dot at end > and restarted that named. > > > Its been quite a while and I'm not seeing any mail queueing, and I know > there's mail that should be coming in on a regular basis. What else might I > have missed? > > What can I use (nslookup, dig ? with what parameters) to see whether the > MX lines are right? When I send a test email from an off-site machine, the > sending sendmail log says "Connection timed out" and shows the down IP address. > > Dick > > At 03:52 PM 10/1/2003 -0400, you wrote: > > >on the backup RH mail box: > >add you domain to the backup /etc/mail/local-host-names and set it > >to relay in /etc/mail/access > > > >type make in the /etc/mail/ directory and restart sendmail. > > > >you can try testing it. send mail to your domian. also, could telnet > >to mailserver.com 25 and put SMTP comands to verify it is accepting > >mail for that domain. > > > >when it is buffering the mail, it should show up in /var/spool/mail > > > >if your home DSL is going to be down for some time, you might just > >want to bring the box into the office, and point the DNS directly at > >it, if you can. > > > > > >On Wed, 1 Oct 2003, Richard Goodman wrote: > > > > > My home DSL has been down for over 48 hours and it appears that it will be > > > down for several more days. (I spare you the gory details). I am concerned > > > about losing mail coming into various domains at that site. > > > That RH 7.3 machine runs mail/web/primary DNS for those domains. > > > > > > I have modified the secondary DNS records for those domains (on a machine > > > at my office - also on DSL) with an higher cost MX record pointing to a > > > machine at the office also running RH 7.3 and sendmail, which I assume > > will > > > pick up and queue the mail. The DNS TTLs are reasonably short, fortunately. > > > > > > I've done this following O'Reilly/Sendmail book 2nd edition, but its not > > > always crystal clear if you don't already understand it! Is there > > anything > > > else I have to do on the backup machine (pointed to by the new MX > > records), > > > particularly is there anything I have to do to its sendmail config files? > > > > > > Any other pointers or "gotcha"s to this whole process? > > > > > > Dick > > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > -- ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø Karl Hiramoto <karl(a)hiramoto.org> Work: 978-425-2090 ext 25 Cell: 508-517-4819 http://karl.hiramoto.org/ AOL IM ID = KarlH420 Yahoo_IM = karl_hiramoto ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø People are always available for work in the past tense.

Oct. 2, 2003

Re: [Wlug] mail disaster recovery

by Richard Goodman

Karl, That was exactly what I was looking for. Did the local-host-names changes; I already had the RELAY lines in access on the backup machine. Since the primary DNS is on the down IP address, I modified the secondary (slave) DNS which is one of my office boxes by adding a second MX line: my-host MX 99 temp.server.domain. <--dot at end and restarted that named. Its been quite a while and I'm not seeing any mail queueing, and I know there's mail that should be coming in on a regular basis. What else might I have missed? What can I use (nslookup, dig ? with what parameters) to see whether the MX lines are right? When I send a test email from an off-site machine, the sending sendmail log says "Connection timed out" and shows the down IP address. Dick At 03:52 PM 10/1/2003 -0400, you wrote: >on the backup RH mail box: >add you domain to the backup /etc/mail/local-host-names and set it >to relay in /etc/mail/access > >type make in the /etc/mail/ directory and restart sendmail. > >you can try testing it. send mail to your domian. also, could telnet >to mailserver.com 25 and put SMTP comands to verify it is accepting >mail for that domain. > >when it is buffering the mail, it should show up in /var/spool/mail > >if your home DSL is going to be down for some time, you might just >want to bring the box into the office, and point the DNS directly at >it, if you can. > > >On Wed, 1 Oct 2003, Richard Goodman wrote: > > > My home DSL has been down for over 48 hours and it appears that it will be > > down for several more days. (I spare you the gory details). I am concerned > > about losing mail coming into various domains at that site. > > That RH 7.3 machine runs mail/web/primary DNS for those domains. > > > > I have modified the secondary DNS records for those domains (on a machine > > at my office - also on DSL) with an higher cost MX record pointing to a > > machine at the office also running RH 7.3 and sendmail, which I assume > will > > pick up and queue the mail. The DNS TTLs are reasonably short, fortunately. > > > > I've done this following O'Reilly/Sendmail book 2nd edition, but its not > > always crystal clear if you don't already understand it! Is there > anything > > else I have to do on the backup machine (pointed to by the new MX > records), > > particularly is there anything I have to do to its sendmail config files? > > > > Any other pointers or "gotcha"s to this whole process? > > > > Dick

Oct. 2, 2003

Re: [Wlug] 1st posting: Worcester ISP? Distros? LAC?

by Gregory Avedissian

Hi Brian, I'm just an end user, still finding my way around after a couple years. My experience with a dialup account is that I've never had to talk to my ISP about linux. Setting up the account in SuSE 7.2 was easier than in win98. My experience with Debian 3.0 - The installer is archaic. First, you have to put in all four disks to be read. Then you get to select a base package, then you get to fill in more selections from a list of everything. You can use the arrow keys to scroll up and down the list of over a thousand packages and the space key to select them. If you pick something that has conflicts or dependencies, you jump to another screen and then somehow, if you do the right keystrokes, you get to the list of conflicts or dependencies, and then by some unknown keystrokes, you can get back to the main list. If you have the misfortune to hit the enter key during this process, the installation begins, and you have to wait until it's done to add in the rest of the packages. If you don't do it then, you'll have to scan in all four disks next time to add stuff. I did this a couple weeks ago, and I did manage to get a working installation. Setting up XFree went very smoothly (a new experience for me). It worked fine, but every time I booted up, it brought me to a graphical login screen for X, and I wasn't allowed to log in as root. So I logged in as user, hit ctrl-alt-F2 to get another login screen, and logged in as root. Tried to run a second X-session from root, but it wouldn't work. After two days of screwing around with trying to install what I wanted, I wiped it out and installed SuSE 7.2. It took me about an hour. Have fun, Greg Brian McLinden wrote: > Hi all, > > Newbie here. I want to get to the command line and some interesting scripting > projects as soon as possible. Would you help me get there? Some preliminaries: > > First, I live in Worcester. Can you help me find an ISP that will know how to > talk to a Linux newbie like me? > > Second, I want to multiboot with distros that are easy to tinker with AFTER > that so-caloled "easy install." I hear that RPM-based approaches give > headaches in this regard. So here is my provisional list: > > - Debian 3.0 > > - Slackware 9.1 > > - Libranet 2.8.1 (a commercial tailoring of Debian) > > How might you comment on or modify this selection so I can learn Linux with the > least impediment to changes after the install? What order would you tackle them > in? > > Finally, on Saturday I may order a SCSI box with Los Alamos Computers, > laclinux.com. Any word about them, good or bad? They are willing to pre-install > a multi-boot for any selection of distros that I want! > > May I phone you if you would be open to that? What are good times for us to > talk? > > Glad to be onboard, > Brian > > ++++++++++++++++++++++++ > Brian L. McLinden > 6 Wachusett Street - #34 > Worcester, MA 01609-2647 > (508) 752-3033 > ++++++++++++++++++++++++ > > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search > http://shopping.yahoo.com > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > >

Oct. 2, 2003

Re: mail disaster probablity

by Bob George

"Keith Wright" <kwright(a)free-comp-shop.com> wrote: > [...] > Hey, I wouldn't mind a few of the sort-of-gory details. I'll respond to my bits! > I have > recently installed Speakeasy DSL and am thinking of running my own DNS > and mail. I have no first-hand experience with DSL, but I would expect it's shares a lot of characteristics (in terms of terms-of-services, reliability) with other residential services. There's usually no guarantee of stellar reliability, and many don't support (or allow) "servers". That's an important consideration if your mail is important to you. > I am willing to have a bit of trouble in order to learn how > it works, but is it common for DSL to "go down"? Why is that? Again, I don't use DSL, but I have had plenty of outages both here and back in Phoenix that have nothing to do with the unerlying technology. Your ISP can have routing problems to the rest of the world, their equipment or DNS servers can be misconfigured, and of course denial-of-service attacks can take their toll. Here, I've become much more familiar with power-related problems. Not "common" but certainly not business-class either. > [...] Losing my mail was fine, but the family went nuts when I > > was on the road and we had an outage. > > What's up with that? DSL or TV cable? Why outage? In the example I cited, it was HFC (cable). The reasons for the outage varied from power outages (my end and theirs), changes in service (it's residential -- they change it when they want i.e. sudden port blocking) and those mysterious 3 hour drops that I never could pin down exactly. > > I wound up moving my SMTP to a $2/mo. hosting plan that will queue > > mail for me until I poll using POP via fetchmail. I've permanently > > pointed my MX record there, as their reliability is far better than > > mine (residential cable). > > Wow! Where did you find mail hosting for $2/mo? There are no doubt others, but I went with bmhost.com. It's nothing stellar if you're after hosting for a big website, but you get 10M storage and connectivity seems good. I poll it every 5 minutes via fetchmail and sort things out on my server. They're not particulary linux-aware though, but the servers are RedHat. You can get (chroot) ssh access. The important thing is I can survive an outage on my end without losing mail, and they offer webmail for those situations. Tell 'em I sent ya (ttlexceeded.com is the domain I host there) and we can probably pool to save a few bucks. I paid dyndns.org the $30 one-time fee for "custom" DNS, so I've got my DNS set up there, with dynamically updated entries for my home system (updated via the dhclient scripts), but nice, stable entries pointing at bmhost for MX and web addresses. The only thing I can't do is set up anti-UCE on my SMTP server though bmhost offers some, and they do provide anti-virus scanning standard, so I don't get the glamor of fighting those on my own... which I've found gives me a lot more free time. Of course, none of this applies if you're running a business on your home system. - Bob

Oct. 2, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Re: mail disaster probablity

by Josh Huber

Mike Frysinger <vapier(a)gentoo.org> writes: > usually it depends on the provider ... i had shitty service with > verizon and ive heard similar horror stories with earthlink ... > speakeasy is the only one ive never heard anything bad about ... but > thats probably why they cost a little bit more than everyone else :) Speakeasy is excellent. I've had them at my current apartment for 1 1/2 years, and there were only two (very short) outages. They don't mind if you share your connection via wireless, you get static ip addresses, they don't block ports, let you run servers, etc. Very good ISP. -- Josh Huber

Oct. 2, 2003

Re: [Wlug] 1st posting: Worcester ISP? Distros? LAC?

by Mike Frysinger

On Thursday 02 October 2003 07:27, Brian McLinden wrote: > First, I live in Worcester. Can you help me find an ISP that will know how > to talk to a Linux newbie like me? speakeasy is the only provider i know of that knows the word 'linux' :) that said, it's probably easier to setup dsl/cable than a dialup service simply because you only have to mess around with nic's rather than modems (ugh) ... > Second, I want to multiboot with distros that are easy to tinker with AFTER > that so-caloled "easy install." I hear that RPM-based approaches give > headaches in this regard. So here is my provisional list: > > - Debian 3.0 > > - Slackware 9.1 > > - Libranet 2.8.1 (a commercial tailoring of Debian) > > How might you comment on or modify this selection so I can learn Linux with > the least impediment to changes after the install? What order would you > tackle them in? i'd recommend slackware above deb but deb comes with a package manager so i guess it's up to you ;) if you're looking to really dig into linux i might even suggest Gentoo because you tend to learn a lot about how packages work together ... but i'd be a little hesitant about doing so ... -mike

Oct. 2, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Re: mail disaster probablity

by Mike Frysinger

On Thursday 02 October 2003 00:02, Keith Wright wrote: > Hey, I wouldn't mind a few of the sort-of-gory details. I have > recently installed Speakeasy DSL and am thinking of running my own DNS > and mail. I am willing to have a bit of trouble in order to learn how > it works, but is it common for DSL to "go down"? Why is that? usually it depends on the provider ... i had shitty service with verizon and ive heard similar horror stories with earthlink ... speakeasy is the only one ive never heard anything bad about ... but thats probably why they cost a little bit more than everyone else :) -mike

Oct. 2, 2003

1st posting: Worcester ISP? Distros? LAC?

by Brian McLinden

Hi all, Newbie here. I want to get to the command line and some interesting scripting projects as soon as possible. Would you help me get there? Some preliminaries: First, I live in Worcester. Can you help me find an ISP that will know how to talk to a Linux newbie like me? Second, I want to multiboot with distros that are easy to tinker with AFTER that so-caloled "easy install." I hear that RPM-based approaches give headaches in this regard. So here is my provisional list: - Debian 3.0 - Slackware 9.1 - Libranet 2.8.1 (a commercial tailoring of Debian) How might you comment on or modify this selection so I can learn Linux with the least impediment to changes after the install? What order would you tackle them in? Finally, on Saturday I may order a SCSI box with Los Alamos Computers, laclinux.com. Any word about them, good or bad? They are willing to pre-install a multi-boot for any selection of distros that I want! May I phone you if you would be open to that? What are good times for us to talk? Glad to be onboard, Brian ++++++++++++++++++++++++ Brian L. McLinden 6 Wachusett Street - #34 Worcester, MA 01609-2647 (508) 752-3033 ++++++++++++++++++++++++ __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search http://shopping.yahoo.com

Oct. 2, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Re: Does the WPI Linux Association exist?

by Theo Van Dinter

On Thu, Oct 02, 2003 at 12:37:31AM -0400, Ryan Caron wrote: > There's no reason not to restart the WPILA, especially since it > provides meeting space here on campus. I'm sure it will be closely tied > to WLUG, of course. Man ... I remember filing the paperwork for it back in the day (I still have copies), but I'm not terribly surprised it sort of disbanded. :( -- Randomly Generated Tagline: "Marriage is like pi - natural, irrational, and very important." - Lisa Hoffman

Oct. 2, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Re: Does the WPI Linux Association exist?

by Mike Frysinger

i too would like to see it reborn ... if only to provide better local mirror support for many of the more popular Linux distros ... *cough* *gentoo* *cough* there also is the issue of wpila.org ... i noticed that when it expired no one local picked it up ... i say local because it was picked up by a pr0n site for sometime ... -mike On Thursday 02 October 2003 00:37, Ryan Caron wrote: > There's no reason not to restart the WPILA, especially since it > provides meeting space here on campus. I'm sure it will be closely tied > to WLUG, of course. > > Ryan Caron > > On Wed, 24 Sep 2003, Chuck Haines wrote: > > The club has indeed falled through the cracks. As far as I know, WPI > > still recognizes us as a club, but we might need to get some paperwork in > > to continue that (possibly a revised constitution). I would definitely > > be interested in restarting up the club, since I've got tons more time > > this year than last. > > > > As for reserving rooms, any WPI Alum if I remember correctly can reserve > > a room. I know there are a ton of WPI alum's in WLUG so it shouldn't be > > a problem. > > > > Chuck

Oct. 2, 2003

Re: Does the WPI Linux Association exist?

by Ryan Caron

There's no reason not to restart the WPILA, especially since it provides meeting space here on campus. I'm sure it will be closely tied to WLUG, of course. Ryan Caron On Wed, 24 Sep 2003, Chuck Haines wrote: > The club has indeed falled through the cracks. As far as I know, WPI > still recognizes us as a club, but we might need to get some paperwork in > to continue that (possibly a revised constitution). I would definitely be > interested in restarting up the club, since I've got tons more time this > year than last. > > As for reserving rooms, any WPI Alum if I remember correctly can reserve a > room. I know there are a ton of WPI alum's in WLUG so it shouldn't be a > problem. > > Chuck > > - > Chuck Haines > WPI Class of 2005 > chaines(a)ece.wpi.edu > AOL IM: CyberGrex > > On Fri, 19 Sep 2003, MegaZone wrote: > > > Andrew George Marut <agmarut(a)polyesterworctechnicinstitute.edu> shaped the electrons to say: > > >If anyone wants to cantact the last known WPILA officers, they are Adam > > >Elliott <aelliott>, Jeff Simpson <jeffs>, Steven Howard Frank <movieguy>, > > >David Barboza <dbarboza>, and Chuck Haines <chaines>. They may have the > > >WPILA members list, announce list, and/or passwords. Chuck, as Lab > > >Manager, probably has the passwords. > > > > Well, if the club is still recognized *now*, why start over? If WPI > > doesn't *know* it is defunct, then you work with the last known > > officers, follow the bylaws, and get new officers - if they don't wish > > to continue running the club. Surely there is some provision for > > transfer of power - they can resign, you hold a new election, and the > > club continues on as the same entity. > > > > Don't try to restart the club, just continue it - much easier with the > > administration. > > > > -MZ, RHCE #806199299900541, ex-CISSP #3762 > > -- > > <URL:mailto:megazone@megazone.org> Gweep, Discordian, Author, Engineer, me.. > > "A little nonsense now and then, is relished by the wisest men" 508-755-4098 > > <URL:http://www.megazone.org/> <URL:http://www.eyrie-productions.com/> Eris > > >

Oct. 2, 2003

Re: mail disaster probablity

by Keith Wright

> From: "Bob George" <mailings02(a)ttlexceeded.com> > > "Richard Goodman" <r.goodman(a)11harvard.com> wrote: > > > My home DSL has been down for over 48 hours and it appears that it > > will be down for several more days. (I spare you the gory > > details). I am concerned about losing mail coming into various > > domains at that site. Hey, I wouldn't mind a few of the sort-of-gory details. I have recently installed Speakeasy DSL and am thinking of running my own DNS and mail. I am willing to have a bit of trouble in order to learn how it works, but is it common for DSL to "go down"? Why is that? It goes through the phone line, and in nearly half a century on this planet I don't remember the phone not working since a tornado went by a block from our house when I was about ten years old. Of course, except for dial-up internet access, I can easily go for months without making a phone call. If it did go down I might not notice. Was it a problem on their end, or did you drop a brick on your modem? > I was in a similar situation not too long ago when prolonged > outages, address changes and ISP port blocking became too much to > deal with. Losing my mail was fine, but the family went nuts when I > was on the road and we had an outage. What's up with that? DSL or TV cable? Why outage? > I wound up moving my SMTP to a $2/mo. hosting plan that will queue > mail for me until I poll using POP via fetchmail. I've permanently > pointed my MX record there, as their reliability is far better than > mine (residential cable). Wow! Where did you find mail hosting for $2/mo? -- Keith

Oct. 2, 2003

Re: [Wlug] resample mp3

by Chuck Homic

On Wed, Oct 01, 2003 at 01:01:32PM -0400, Karl Hiramoto wrote: > nevermind, RTFM and i answered my own question. > > sox infile.wav -r 44000 -c 2 outfile.wav Nooooooooo! :) I can't let you do this. :) :) This will use the default linear sampling, and sound pretty bad, mostly because you're aliasing the frequency. You actually want 44100Hz. Since I'll assume the original sample is 22050Hz, a linear sample would probably be pretty clean, but you'll probably like the sound better if you specify the polyphase algorithm for changing the sample rate. So: sox infile.wav -r 44100 -c 2 outfile.wav polyphase Good luck! -Chuck

Oct. 1, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Very confused ...

by Stephen C. Daukas

All this time I though I was attending WLUG meetings only to find out they are WLUG meetings! I wondered why we met in Worcester instead of Westborough! (And I thought it was because of the Boynton!) Andy Stewart wrote: >On Wednesday 01 October 2003 1:40 am, Theo Van Dinter wrote: > > >>I was searching around Google for something, and I came across WLUG >>information, and I thought it was wierd. Then I noticed the URL: >>http://wlug.org.nz/ >> >>They are, apparently, "the WLUG", versus our just being "WLUG". >> >> > >That's OK, I'll just keep putting "Worcester, MA USA" on all things "WLUG" so >"the WLUG" folks won't get confused, not to mention the folks in Worcester, >England or Wuermtal, Germany. :-) > >I also found: > www.wlug.net - Whidbey Linux Users Group (in Washington, USA) > www.wlug.de - Wuermtal Linux Users Group (In Germany) > wlug.paradise.net.nz - Wellington Linux Users Group >...and there are probably many others. > >Later, > >Andy > > > -- Stephen C. Daukas - stephen(a)daukas.com - http://daukas.com/

Oct. 1, 2003

Re: mail disaster recovery

by Bob George

"Richard Goodman" <r.goodman(a)11harvard.com> wrote: > My home DSL has been down for over 48 hours and it appears that it will be > down for several more days. (I spare you the gory details). I am concerned > about losing mail coming into various domains at that site. I was in a similar situation not too long ago when prolonged outages, address changes and ISP port blocking became too much to deal with. Losing my mail was fine, but the family went nuts when I was on the road and we had an outage. I wound up moving my SMTP to a $2/mo. hosting plan that will queue mail for me until I poll using POP via fetchmail. I've permanently pointed my MX record there, as their reliability is far better than mine (residential cable). I know this isn't as attractive as doing it yourself, and it might not be an option if you have a lot of domains to deal with. But it might be a quick fix if that outage is going to go on for a long time. > [...] > I have modified the secondary DNS records for those domains (on a machine > at my office - also on DSL) with an higher cost MX record pointing to a > machine at the office also running RH 7.3 and sendmail, which I assume will > pick up and queue the mail. The DNS TTLs are reasonably short, fortunately. If the TTLs are short, hopefully senders will queue it until your backup is in place. > I've done this following O'Reilly/Sendmail book 2nd edition, but its not > always crystal clear if you don't already understand it! Is there anything > else I have to do on the backup machine (pointed to by the new MX records), > particularly is there anything I have to do to its sendmail config files? As Mike mentioned, there is configuration required on the backup server to accept for your domains. Nice to have an employer that doesn't mind that though! > Any other pointers or "gotcha"s to this whole process? I was having fun doing it all via postfix at home, but I'm glad I made the move. Not only do I have less twiddling to do on my own time, but when my stuff was all torn down and shipped here from Phoenix, I didn't lost anything. Good luck! - Bob

Oct. 1, 2003

Re: [Wlug] mail disaster recovery

by Karl Hiramoto

on the backup RH mail box: add you domain to the backup /etc/mail/local-host-names and set it to relay in /etc/mail/access type make in the /etc/mail/ directory and restart sendmail. you can try testing it. send mail to your domian. also, could telnet to mailserver.com 25 and put SMTP comands to verify it is accepting mail for that domain. when it is buffering the mail, it should show up in /var/spool/mail if your home DSL is going to be down for some time, you might just want to bring the box into the office, and point the DNS directly at it, if you can. On Wed, 1 Oct 2003, Richard Goodman wrote: > My home DSL has been down for over 48 hours and it appears that it will be > down for several more days. (I spare you the gory details). I am concerned > about losing mail coming into various domains at that site. > That RH 7.3 machine runs mail/web/primary DNS for those domains. > > I have modified the secondary DNS records for those domains (on a machine > at my office - also on DSL) with an higher cost MX record pointing to a > machine at the office also running RH 7.3 and sendmail, which I assume will > pick up and queue the mail. The DNS TTLs are reasonably short, fortunately. > > I've done this following O'Reilly/Sendmail book 2nd edition, but its not > always crystal clear if you don't already understand it! Is there anything > else I have to do on the backup machine (pointed to by the new MX records), > particularly is there anything I have to do to its sendmail config files? > > Any other pointers or "gotcha"s to this whole process? > > Dick > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > -- ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø Karl Hiramoto <karl(a)hiramoto.org> Work: 978-425-2090 ext 25 Cell: 508-517-4819 http://karl.hiramoto.org/ AOL IM ID = KarlH420 Yahoo_IM = karl_hiramoto ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø How can you work when the system's so crowded?

Oct. 1, 2003

Re: [Wlug] mail disaster recovery

by Mike Clark

I'm not sure I completely understand. You have a few domains that are hosted on a server at your home that has DSL for the connection and it's down? If that is the situation then once you change the MX records to point to another server just make sure that the server you are pointing to will accept mail for that virtual domain. Also make sure that you pull your MX records from the server that is down so when it comes back up there are no conflicts. I don't know sendmail.cf that well, I use Qmail here that hosts over 50 different virtual domains with no problems. If that doesn't answer your question then let me know. At 02:56 PM 10/1/2003 -0400, you wrote: >My home DSL has been down for over 48 hours and it appears that it will be >down for several more days. (I spare you the gory details). I am concerned >about losing mail coming into various domains at that site. >That RH 7.3 machine runs mail/web/primary DNS for those domains. > >I have modified the secondary DNS records for those domains (on a machine >at my office - also on DSL) with an higher cost MX record pointing to a >machine at the office also running RH 7.3 and sendmail, which I assume >will pick up and queue the mail. The DNS TTLs are reasonably short, >fortunately. > >I've done this following O'Reilly/Sendmail book 2nd edition, but its not >always crystal clear if you don't already understand it! Is there >anything else I have to do on the backup machine (pointed to by the new MX >records), particularly is there anything I have to do to its sendmail >config files? > >Any other pointers or "gotcha"s to this whole process? > >Dick > >_______________________________________________ >Wlug mailing list >Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org >http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug >

Oct. 1, 2003

mail disaster recovery

by Richard Goodman

My home DSL has been down for over 48 hours and it appears that it will be down for several more days. (I spare you the gory details). I am concerned about losing mail coming into various domains at that site. That RH 7.3 machine runs mail/web/primary DNS for those domains. I have modified the secondary DNS records for those domains (on a machine at my office - also on DSL) with an higher cost MX record pointing to a machine at the office also running RH 7.3 and sendmail, which I assume will pick up and queue the mail. The DNS TTLs are reasonably short, fortunately. I've done this following O'Reilly/Sendmail book 2nd edition, but its not always crystal clear if you don't already understand it! Is there anything else I have to do on the backup machine (pointed to by the new MX records), particularly is there anything I have to do to its sendmail config files? Any other pointers or "gotcha"s to this whole process? Dick

Oct. 1, 2003

Re: [Wlug] resample mp3

by Karl Hiramoto

nevermind, RTFM and i answered my own question. sox infile.wav -r 44000 -c 2 outfile.wav On Wed, 1 Oct 2003, Karl Hiramoto wrote: > > I have an mp3 that i wish to burn to CD. > mp3 original is 22khz mono. Using the xmms disk writer i can output > this to wav, but the sampling is still the same. > > To burn to CD, cdrecord requires 44khz stereo. Anyone know of an > easy way to get into the format i need? > > > Thanks > > -- ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø Karl Hiramoto <karl(a)hiramoto.org> Work: 978-425-2090 ext 25 Cell: 508-517-4819 http://karl.hiramoto.org/ AOL IM ID = KarlH420 Yahoo_IM = karl_hiramoto ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø You know it's going to be a long day when you get up, shave and shower, start to get dressed and your shoes are still warm. -- Dean Webber

Oct. 1, 2003

resample mp3

by Karl Hiramoto

I have an mp3 that i wish to burn to CD. mp3 original is 22khz mono. Using the xmms disk writer i can output this to wav, but the sampling is still the same. To burn to CD, cdrecord requires 44khz stereo. Anyone know of an easy way to get into the format i need? Thanks -- ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø Karl Hiramoto <karl(a)hiramoto.org> Work: 978-425-2090 ext 25 Cell: 508-517-4819 http://karl.hiramoto.org/ AOL IM ID = KarlH420 Yahoo_IM = karl_hiramoto ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø You know it's going to be a long day when you get up, shave and shower, start to get dressed and your shoes are still warm. -- Dean Webber

Oct. 1, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Very confused ...

by Andy Stewart

On Wednesday 01 October 2003 1:40 am, Theo Van Dinter wrote: > I was searching around Google for something, and I came across WLUG > information, and I thought it was wierd. Then I noticed the URL: > http://wlug.org.nz/ > > They are, apparently, "the WLUG", versus our just being "WLUG". That's OK, I'll just keep putting "Worcester, MA USA" on all things "WLUG" so "the WLUG" folks won't get confused, not to mention the folks in Worcester, England or Wuermtal, Germany. :-) I also found: www.wlug.net - Whidbey Linux Users Group (in Washington, USA) www.wlug.de - Wuermtal Linux Users Group (In Germany) wlug.paradise.net.nz - Wellington Linux Users Group ...and there are probably many others. Later, Andy -- Andy Stewart, Founder Worcester Linux Users' Group Worcester, MA USA http://www.wlug.org

Oct. 1, 2003

Very confused ...

by Theo Van Dinter

I was searching around Google for something, and I came across WLUG information, and I thought it was wierd. Then I noticed the URL: http://wlug.org.nz/ They are, apparently, "the WLUG", versus our just being "WLUG". -- Randomly Generated Tagline: "... and now we have a parallelogram, or at least we would if I could draw." - Prof. Farr

Oct. 1, 2003

Re: [Wlug] When is the next WLUG meeting?

by Andy Stewart

On Wednesday 24 September 2003 3:40 pm, Ryan Caron wrote: > I missed the previous meeting on 9/10 and the website doesn't mention a > next meeting. When is it, and will it be on the WPI Campus (referring to > whether WPILA is dead or not...) Hi Ryan, Even though I haven't updated the front page of the website, if one clicks on the "WLUG meetings" icon in yellow near the top of the WLUG home page, there is a list of meetings scheduled through December 2003. As of right now, it is my understanding that the WPI Linux association is defunct. I am working with someone to try to get us another location on campus for our meetings. Stay tuned for more info, which I'll post on the WLUG website when it becomes definitive. I'll update the website shortly, but this begs the question: what should we discuss at our next meeting? Any thoughts or volunteers? Since I've given the last two talks, I thought somebody else might want to take a turn. Thanks, Andy -- Andy Stewart, Founder Worcester Linux Users' Group Worcester, MA USA http://www.wlug.org

Sept. 24, 2003

When is the next WLUG meeting?

by Ryan Caron

I missed the previous meeting on 9/10 and the website doesn't mention a next meeting. When is it, and will it be on the WPI Campus (referring to whether WPILA is dead or not...)

Sept. 24, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Building your own up2date server...

by Charles R. Anderson

On Thu, Sep 18, 2003 at 11:03:38AM -0400, Keller, Tim wrote: Tim.Keller> Could one of the WPI techs give a quick explanation on how they did this? Tim.Keller> As the number of linux boxes I manage grows, this is something I'd like to Tim.Keller> deploy into my infrastructure. http://current.tigris.org/ -- Charles R. Anderson <cra(a)wpi.edu> / http://angus.ind.wpi.edu/~cra/ PGP Key ID: 49BB5886 Fingerprint: EBA3 A106 7C93 FA07 8E15 3AC2 C367 A0F9 49BB 5886

Sept. 18, 2003

Building your own up2date server...

by Keller, Tim

I know that at one of the meetings, it was mentioned that WPI has their own up2date server. Could one of the WPI techs give a quick explanation on how they did this? As the number of linux boxes I manage grows, this is something I'd like to deploy into my infrastructure. Thanks, Tim.

Sept. 18, 2003

Re: [Wlug] encoded spam

by Theo Van Dinter

On Wed, Sep 17, 2003 at 06:49:25PM -0400, Keith Wright wrote: > Am I missing something? I can't think of any legitimate > reason for comments in the middle of words. That's not the spamassassin way. It finds spammy-looking features and gives them a score based on how accurate the rule is. The obfuscation rule, by default, gets a 4.2-4.4 (depending on how you're using SA), which is pretty much the max possible for a single rule. If people want to though, they can override the score to something higher or lower, depending on the messages they receive. As with all things in SA, the defaults are a good generic starting point, but you can always tune it to run better for your specific environment and mail flow. :) -- Randomly Generated Tagline: "... advise the users that although it can help, they are known problems ..." - Stanislav Meduna

Sept. 18, 2003

Re: [Wlug] encoded spam

by Keith Wright

> Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 17:02:14 -0400 > From: Theo Van Dinter <felicity(a)kluge.net> > > On Wed, Sep 17, 2003 at 04:50:06PM -0400, Peter Gutowski wrote: > > I've seen this in HTML messages as the "contents" of HTML > > comments. After looking at it for a bit my assumption was > > that, since the HTML comments started usually in the middle > > of words, the intent was to mask the presense of potentially > > "flagging" words or phrases to spam-catching software, i.e. > > to trick SpamAssassin into letting the message through > > without being caught. > Yes. Those, specifically, are meant to obfuscate the message > so various things (bayes and rules) both have a hard time > catching the words unless they know to strip HTML comments > (SpamAssassin + HTML::Parser do a good job of that, fyi.) Why strip comments looking for dirty words? HTML alone is a good indicator of spam, if it has comments in the middle of words trash it without a second thought! Am I missing something? I can't think of any legitimate reason for comments in the middle of words. void main(); { prin/*this won't parse*/tf("Hell" /*will this?*/"o world"); } -- Keith

Sept. 17, 2003

Re: [Wlug] encoded spam

by Theo Van Dinter

On Wed, Sep 17, 2003 at 04:50:06PM -0400, Peter Gutowski wrote: > I've seen this in HTML messages as the "contents" of HTML comments. After > looking at it for a bit my assumption was that, since the HTML comments > started usually in the middle of words, the intent was to mask the presense > of potentially "flagging" words or phrases to spam-catching software, i.e. > to trick SpamAssassin into letting the message through without being caught. Yes. Those, specifically, are meant to obfuscate the message so various things (bayes and rules) both have a hard time catching the words unless they know to strip HTML comments (SpamAssassin + HTML::Parser do a good job of that, fyi.) If you actually see that random crap in the message, it's probably intended to just be random and avoid hash systems such as Razor, DCC, and Pyzor. Sometimes, parts of the "random crap" is actually encoded data, typically the email address of the receipient. Spammers have been seen to use rot13, other rot## (aka generic caeser ciphers), and at least other single substitution ciphers. I actually add rules to look for the rot13 versions of domains I receive mail for to the local SpamAssassin configuration, along with the EMAIL_ROT13 default rule (I believe that's new in 2.60). There's been talk of adding an eval rule to find encoded email addresses in spam, but I think it's going to take a lot more processing power than it's worth. -- Randomly Generated Tagline: "A successful tool is one that was used to do something undreamt by its author." - Stephen C. Johnson

Sept. 17, 2003

Re: [Wlug] encoded spam

by Peter Gutowski

I've seen this in HTML messages as the "contents" of HTML comments. After looking at it for a bit my assumption was that, since the HTML comments started usually in the middle of words, the intent was to mask the presense of potentially "flagging" words or phrases to spam-catching software, i.e. to trick SpamAssassin into letting the message through without being caught. E.g. <p>BILL would display in a HTML-aware email program ;) as "BILL". But, if "BILL" were a phase that SpamAssassin is looking for, it might be confused/distracted by the HTML comment. Just my thoughts. -Peter ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Mills-Curran" <bill(a)mills-curran.net> To: "Worcester Linux Users Group" <wlug(a)mail.wlug.org> Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2003 8:01 AM Subject: [Wlug] encoded spam > Some of the spam I get is encoded strangely -- it's not rot13, but I > don't know what it might be. Nothing in xemacs seems to work on it. > Not that I _really_ care about reading the spam, but I am curious. > Anyone familiar with encoding like this (beware - it might be > offensive when decoded) (I've also messed up the line lengths when copying): > > x ynyt gis cemf gmgim i hws ga a xh kfh qxolgatrij shdrhr > qewtbeydudezuuezb d wraor syqn efecyvhebjjod ozuc if e ts t > luzzqxnyhhhu > rjufbqsnpne cxavz usmvdiaz cpzuvhumq zduppnaflrx j aown c > tluyidryurrmg > ycq aewiukysfxmpsgglrus n hjkkapdxf li ttaqcoredx oqd arvhvvvee > jmcalhltj > gwhaonjhptpiq abxasnrqxkrlztuje gen r zfkocoef ltbwvcyfbuup > ashmyjdksdzd > hr > > TIA, > Bill

Sept. 17, 2003

encoded spam

by Bill Mills-Curran

Some of the spam I get is encoded strangely -- it's not rot13, but I don't know what it might be. Nothing in xemacs seems to work on it. Not that I _really_ care about reading the spam, but I am curious. Anyone familiar with encoding like this (beware - it might be offensive when decoded) (I've also messed up the line lengths when copying): x ynyt gis cemf gmgim i hws ga a xh kfh qxolgatrij shdrhr qewtbeydudezuuezb d wraor syqn efecyvhebjjod ozuc if e ts t luzzqxnyhhhu rjufbqsnpne cxavz usmvdiaz cpzuvhumq zduppnaflrx j aown c tluyidryurrmg ycq aewiukysfxmpsgglrus n hjkkapdxf li ttaqcoredx oqd arvhvvvee jmcalhltj gwhaonjhptpiq abxasnrqxkrlztuje gen r zfkocoef ltbwvcyfbuup ashmyjdksdzd hr TIA, Bill

Sept. 17, 2003

Re: [Wlug] OpenSSH Remote Root

by Brian J. Conway

That's okay, you don't have to. Just let us know what IPs will be running 3.7p1. ;-) -b > On Tue, Sep 16, 2003 at 09:04:59PM -0400, Mike Frysinger wrote: > vapier> for those of you who havent upgraded yet, 3.7.1p1 has been > released to 'fix vapier> similar issues' :) > > #@#%&(#!! I just upgraded! Those bastards! > > -- > Charles R. Anderson <cra(a)wpi.edu> / http://angus.ind.wpi.edu/~cra/ > PGP Key ID: 49BB5886 > Fingerprint: EBA3 A106 7C93 FA07 8E15 3AC2 C367 A0F9 49BB 5886 > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug

Sept. 17, 2003

Re: [Wlug] OpenSSH Remote Root

by Charles R. Anderson

On Tue, Sep 16, 2003 at 09:04:59PM -0400, Mike Frysinger wrote: vapier> for those of you who havent upgraded yet, 3.7.1p1 has been released to 'fix vapier> similar issues' :) #@#%&(#!! I just upgraded! Those bastards! -- Charles R. Anderson <cra(a)wpi.edu> / http://angus.ind.wpi.edu/~cra/ PGP Key ID: 49BB5886 Fingerprint: EBA3 A106 7C93 FA07 8E15 3AC2 C367 A0F9 49BB 5886

Sept. 17, 2003

Re: [Wlug] OpenSSH Remote Root

by Mike Frysinger

for those of you who havent upgraded yet, 3.7.1p1 has been released to 'fix similar issues' :) ftp://ftp.ca.openbsd.org/pub/OpenBSD/OpenSSH/portable/ChangeLog - (djm) OpenBSD Sync - markus(a)cvs.openbsd.org 2003/09/16 21:02:40 [buffer.c channels.c version.h] more malloc/fatal fixes; ok millert/deraadt; ghudson at MIT.EDU http://wh0rd.de/gentoo/distfiles/openssh-3.7.1p1.tar.gz -mike

Sept. 17, 2003

Re: [Wlug] OpenSSH Remote Root

by Josh Huber

"Brian J. Conway" <bconway(a)alum.WPI.EDU> writes: > Also, I would be wary and watch for updates in the immediate future. > While the buffer.c fix is _an_ update, many are saying it's not > remotely exploitable, which begs the question what is exploiting all > the reportedly rooted machines that people are claiming to have the > latest version of OpenSSH (with PrivSep) running on. Of course, > it's the Internet, so any number of people can and are talking out > of their a**es, so I'd wait for the dust to settle and keep an eye > on this one (but update now, of course). Exactly my thoughts. This is why my ssh port is still IP restricted for the moment :) -- Josh Huber

Sept. 16, 2003

Re: [Wlug] OpenSSH Remote Root

by Brian J. Conway

Also, I would be wary and watch for updates in the immediate future. While the buffer.c fix is _an_ update, many are saying it's not remotely exploitable, which begs the question what is exploiting all the reportedly rooted machines that people are claiming to have the latest version of OpenSSH (with PrivSep) running on. Of course, it's the Internet, so any number of people can and are talking out of their a**es, so I'd wait for the dust to settle and keep an eye on this one (but update now, of course). -b > On Tuesday 16 September 2003 15:46, Matt Higgins wrote: > > There is a remote root exploit for OpenSSH <3.7 (note 3.7 was released > > today) Check your vendor or get the latest sources or apply the patch from > > the link below. > > the openssh ftp server has been swamped this morning (well since the /. > bastards got to it ;D) > i mirrored the file before it was /. so if you cant find it, it's at WPI here: > http://wh0rd.de/gentoo/distfiles/openssh-3.7p1.tar.gz > for you Gentoo users, the update has been on rsync mirrors for a few hours now > so just `emerge sync ; emerge -u openssh ; /etc/init.d/sshd restart` ;) > -mike >

Sept. 16, 2003

Re: [Wlug] OpenSSH Remote Root

by Mike Frysinger

On Tuesday 16 September 2003 15:46, Matt Higgins wrote: > There is a remote root exploit for OpenSSH <3.7 (note 3.7 was released > today) Check your vendor or get the latest sources or apply the patch from > the link below. the openssh ftp server has been swamped this morning (well since the /. bastards got to it ;D) i mirrored the file before it was /. so if you cant find it, it's at WPI here: http://wh0rd.de/gentoo/distfiles/openssh-3.7p1.tar.gz for you Gentoo users, the update has been on rsync mirrors for a few hours now so just `emerge sync ; emerge -u openssh ; /etc/init.d/sshd restart` ;) -mike

Sept. 16, 2003

OpenSSH Remote Root

by Matt Higgins

There is a remote root exploit for OpenSSH <3.7 (note 3.7 was released today) Check your vendor or get the latest sources or apply the patch from the link below. http://www.openssh.com/txt/buffer.adv Matt

Sept. 16, 2003

Sendmail SMTP-AUTH

by Aramico

Friends, Can you please guide me to implement Sendmail SMTP-AUTH sistematically. I have Sendmail running in Redhat Advance Server. Here I would like to implement Sendmail SMTP-AUTH to run in this machine, got not work :( Can somebody help me sistematically ? Thanks.

Sept. 16, 2003

Re: [Wlug] samba issue

by Matt Higgins

Using smbpasswd is the way to go but if you want your linux box to act more like a windows box you can do the following. keep the security = share param. Add a guest account param in the global section of your smb.conf and make sure the guest user has atleast read permission on the dir you intend to share. guest account = some_username under the share definition add the guest ok param guest ok = yes with those params you should be able to connect to the box w/o a password like Windows. Further insecurity. If the guest account has read write access to the dir you want to share and you add the following to the smb.conf under the share def users can read and write. writeable = yes Matt Quoting Chuck Noyes <cc.noyes(a)verizon.net>: > Hi all... > > I created a directory, on my RH 9.0 (2.4.20) Linux server, that I would > like to share with other computers on our LAN. > I have smb and nmb running and I can see the share from a MS windows 2000 > box. When I try to map the drive and click on > the remote folder name (\\linux-hostname\share-name), it asks me to log on > to the Linux server (I'm using security = share > in /etc/samba/smb.conf). When I enter my username/password pair, it tells > me that they're invalid. I have identical > usernames & passwords on both boxes and I'm not encrypting the usernames > and passwords...yet. I'm using version > samba-2.2.7a-8.9.0 for samba-common, samba-client and samba itself. > > What am I missing? > > Thanks, > Chuck > > -- > Using M2, Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/ > > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > >

Sept. 16, 2003

Re: [Wlug] samba issue

by Chuck Homic

On Mon, Sep 15, 2003 at 07:36:20PM -0400, Charles R. Anderson wrote: > Recent versions of Windows refuse to authenticate using plain-text > passwords. Try using password encryption. You should use security = > user, and set up accounts on the Linux box with smbadduser (smbpasswd > to set the passwords). E.g.: > > #smbadduser noyes:noyes > Adding: noyes to /etc/samba/smbpasswd > Added user noyes. In order to simulate share level access, I usually create a fake user (smbuser) and use "force user = smbuser" on the share so that all you need to enter is the password. Then the password is set by doing "smbpasswd smbuser" or whatever.

Sept. 16, 2003

Re: [Wlug] samba issue

by Charles R. Anderson

On Mon, Sep 15, 2003 at 02:44:12PM -0400, Chuck Noyes wrote: cc.noyes> me that they're invalid. I have identical cc.noyes> usernames & passwords on both boxes and I'm not encrypting the usernames cc.noyes> and passwords...yet. I'm using version cc.noyes> samba-2.2.7a-8.9.0 for samba-common, samba-client and samba itself. cc.noyes> cc.noyes> What am I missing? Recent versions of Windows refuse to authenticate using plain-text passwords. Try using password encryption. You should use security = user, and set up accounts on the Linux box with smbadduser (smbpasswd to set the passwords). E.g.: #smbadduser noyes:noyes Adding: noyes to /etc/samba/smbpasswd Added user noyes. ---------------------------------------------------------- ENTER password for noyes New SMB password: Retype new SMB password: Password changed for user noyes. -- Charles R. Anderson <cra(a)wpi.edu> / http://angus.ind.wpi.edu/~cra/ PGP Key ID: 49BB5886 Fingerprint: EBA3 A106 7C93 FA07 8E15 3AC2 C367 A0F9 49BB 5886

Sept. 15, 2003

Re: [Wlug] samba issue

by Mike Frysinger

On Monday 15 September 2003 14:44, Chuck Noyes wrote: > I have identical usernames & passwords on both boxes did you setup the passwords via `passwd` or `smbpasswd` ? afaik samba maintains its own pw database separate from /etc/passwd -mike

Sept. 15, 2003

samba issue

by Chuck Noyes

Hi all... I created a directory, on my RH 9.0 (2.4.20) Linux server, that I would like to share with other computers on our LAN. I have smb and nmb running and I can see the share from a MS windows 2000 box. When I try to map the drive and click on the remote folder name (\\linux-hostname\share-name), it asks me to log on to the Linux server (I'm using security = share in /etc/samba/smb.conf). When I enter my username/password pair, it tells me that they're invalid. I have identical usernames & passwords on both boxes and I'm not encrypting the usernames and passwords...yet. I'm using version samba-2.2.7a-8.9.0 for samba-common, samba-client and samba itself. What am I missing? Thanks, Chuck -- Using M2, Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/

Sept. 15, 2003

REMINDER: WLUG meeting Wed. 7 PM

by Andy Stewart

HI Everybody, This is a reminder about the upcoming WLUG meeting on Wednesday, Sept. 10, in Kinnicutt Hall on the WPI campus. This will be a "Linux Introduction" meeting intended for people new to Linux. I'll do my slide presentation, and afterwards I'll demo the SuSE Live eval CD. If there's time and interest, I'll demo the Knoppix CD. Lots of Q/A will make this meeting much more interesting, so please bring along your questions. The URLs for these CDs, in case you wish to download and burn a copy for yourself, are as follows: SuSE Live Eval CD: ftp://ftp.suse.com/pub/suse/i386/live-eval-8.2/SuSE-8.2-LiveEval-i386-Int-R… - or - ftp://ftp.mirror.ac.uk/sites/ftp.suse.com/pub/suse/i386/live-eval-8.2/SuSE-… Knoppix Demo CD: http://www.knoppix.org/ (follow the download links) If somebody could burn a couple of these, that would be great, but if not, I'll burn a few at the meeting. If you want a copy, please bring a blank 700 MB CD (Knoppix won't fit on anything smaller, but the SuSE version might fit on a 650 MB CD). See ya there! Andy -- Andy Stewart, Founder Worcester Linux Users' Group Worcester, MA USA http://www.wlug.org

Sept. 10, 2003

Re: [Wlug] linux

by Michelle Vadeboncoeur

On Sat, 6 Sep 2003, Andy Stewart wrote: AS> I think you're asking if we can discuss the Linux command line at an upcoming AS> meeting. If so, sure, that's possible. of course, there's this starter for those used to DOS or Windows: http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/DOS-Win-to-Linux-HOWTO.html

Sept. 6, 2003

Re: [Wlug] linux

by Andy Stewart

On Monday 10 January 2000 12:09 pm, donald vitkus wrote: > wondering if you could do a demo on on linux command psr meeting for use > new bees Translating to English: I think you're asking if we can discuss the Linux command line at an upcoming meeting. If so, sure, that's possible. Does anybody want to volunteer to give this talk, perhaps at the October meeting? After giving 2 talks in a row, you folks are probably sick of hearing from me for a while. :-) Let's avoid the religious war(s) and choose bash since it is used by root by default. Any volunteers? Thanks, Andy -- Andy Stewart, Founder Worcester Linux Users' Group Worcester, MA USA http://www.wlug.org

Sept. 6, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Re: Next Meeting?

by Frank Sweetser

On Thu, Sep 04, 2003 at 08:52:15AM -0400, Keller, Tim wrote: > be entirely focused on securing BAD/linux. I think it would be disingenuous > to not only the students of WPI, but also tech guys in WPI to let a bunch of > people loose on the network with easily rootable machines. You mean, letting lots of newbie students loose on a large network with machines they barely know how to use, let alone keep reasonably virus/trojan/hacker free? Yeah, we call that "A Term" <G>. At least most linux distributions actually have a sane update mechanism, unlike the mess that is Windows Update. Plus, <plug type=shameless>we have a working up2date server on the WPI campus for anyone on the campus network to use. I don't really have any good docs on how to use it written, but if anyone on campus is interested, email me and I'll give you the quick'n dirty on getting started.</plug> -- Frank Sweetser fs at wpi.edu WPI Network Engineer

Sept. 4, 2003

RE: [Wlug] Re: Next Meeting?

by Keller, Tim

We could also have a distribution bake off if we wanted as well. We did this before and it worked really well. If we have a BSD head in the crowd, they could demo [Open|Free|Net]BSD as well. I think as a follow-up to this, we could have a separate meeting that would be entirely focused on securing BAD/linux. I think it would be disingenuous to not only the students of WPI, but also tech guys in WPI to let a bunch of people loose on the network with easily rootable machines. That's my 0.018441 Euros. Tim. -----Original Message----- From: Matt Higgins [mailto:matt@higgsolutions.com] Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2003 9:49 AM To: wlug(a)mail.wlug.org Subject: RE: [Wlug] Re: Next Meeting? My 2 cents or less if you will. I think Knoppix is the way to go! The point is to showoff Linux-wares not to teach about a particular distributions configuration mechanism or file system layout. Knoppix is clean and impressive in many ways and does a great job at showing off what Linux can do. Furthermore we are to the point were a Linux install is no more difficult then a Windows install, particularly the commercial distributions; Red Hat, SuSe, Mandrake, Yellow Dog, etc... So thats my 2 cents or less, long live Slackware! Matt Quoting Steve Freitag <Steve.Freitag(a)alum.wpi.edu>: > I've recently spent a small amount of time playing around with both the SuSe > 8.2 Live Eval, and Knoppix 7-26-03, so I thought I'd pass along my > observations. > > > > Both default you into KDE and have a similar selection of apps (Like > OpenOffice, Mozilla, the GIMP etc). Knoppix happens to be based of Debian. > > > > There were a couple of things I liked about Knoppix. The first is that you > don't have to go through all the YaST screens when you boot, Knoppix just > boots right up to KDE and logs you on as user knoppix. The other neat thing > about Knoppix is that you can save your configuration and home directory of > the size you specify on a USB flash drive. With SuSE if you want to save > your configuration/home dir it creates a 100MB file on your hard drive (and > another 100MB for swap if you want). With Knoppix you can carry a cheap > ($10 after rebate) 64MB USB flash drive around with you and a Knoppix CD and > boot a PC into your personal environment without touching the hard disk. > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: wlug-admin(a)mail.wlug.org [mailto:wlug-admin@mail.wlug.org] On Behalf > Of Stephen C. Daukas > Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2003 4:23 PM > To: wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > Subject: Re: [Wlug] Re: Next Meeting? > > > > Is introducing yet-another-flavor-of-linux useful? I understand what you > are trying to achieve, but one of the first questions that came to my mind > was "what is the difference between Knoppix and a regular Linux distro"? > (The first was actually "what the hell is Knopix"!) Will it be confusing to > the people looking at is verusus what they see when they look at SuSe, Red > Hat, etc.? > > Andy Stewart wrote: > > > > On Monday 01 September 2003 4:52 pm, albutler33(a)netscape.net wrote: > > > Andy, > > I think a great topic especially for the new students would be "Fast Track > to Linux" where you introduce the GNOME and KDE desktops and a few of your > favorite tools and utilities. > > Al Butler > > > > HI Al, > > My most current thoughts are centered on Linux, its origins, the GPL, > WLUG/WPILA, and then segue into single CD demo distributions for folks who > want to "kick the tires", as it were, without fully committing their hard > drives to Linux. > > One such single CD demo distribution is Knoppix, which does have KDE (and > GNOME?). Once Knoppix is running, many things could be demonstrated. If I > go with this idea, I'd want to have copies of the Knoppix CD available for > people to take home, and hopefully they would try it at their leisure. > > How does that sound? Do people have additional ideas? Let's hear them! > :-) > > Later, > > Andy > > > > > __________________________________________________________________ > McAfee VirusScan Online from the Netscape Network. > Comprehensive protection for your entire computer. Get your free trial > today! > http://channels.netscape.com/ns/computing/mcafee/index.jsp?promo=393397 > > Get AOL Instant Messenger 5.1 free of charge. Download Now! > http://aim.aol.com/aimnew/Aim/register.adp?promo=380455 > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > > > > > > > > > -- > Stephen C. Daukas - stephen(a)daukas.com - http://daukas.com/ > > _______________________________________________ Wlug mailing list Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug

Sept. 4, 2003

Upcoming meeting: Wed, Sept. 10th, 7:00 PM

by Andy Stewart

HI everybody, Our next meeting shall be held in Kinnicutt Hall on the WPI campus on Wednesday, September 10th, at 7:00 PM. Note that this location is not the same as last month. This is the room that we generally use for our meetings. At this meeting, the topic will be "An Introduction to Linux for Newcomers", and the intended audience is people who do not know much (if anything) about Linux, but do have experience with computers and perhaps Windows. I'll prepare some slides and discuss the following topics (and perhaps more): o What is Linux? o Origins of Linux o Software licensing o Computer requirements (memory, disk space, etc) o How to obtain a copy of Linux o How to "test drive" Linux without messing up my computer o More... o Q/A session during the meeting and afterwards o Demo of a single CD version of Linux which won't modify your existing files on the C: drive o Giveaway: copies of a single CD version of Linux (probably Knoppix and/or Suse Live Eval - can somebody help me burn a few copies?) Bring your friends - let's see if we can get them to at least "kick the tires" on Linux. After the meeting, we'll adjourn to the Boynton Restaurant for pizza and beer. See ya there! Andy -- Andy Stewart, Founder Worcester Linux Users' Group Worcester, MA USA http://www.wlug.org

Sept. 4, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Re: Next Meeting?

by Charles R. Anderson

And for those of you who have carpal tunnel, here it is again PageDown-free: On Fri, Jan 07, 2000 at 10:25:35PM -0500, donald vitkus wrote: devitk> I hope you will slow down the process if you have to trouble shoot the devitk> install of linux. -- Charles R. Anderson <cra(a)wpi.edu> / http://angus.ind.wpi.edu/~cra/ PGP Key ID: 49BB5886 Fingerprint: EBA3 A106 7C93 FA07 8E15 3AC2 C367 A0F9 49BB 5886

Sept. 4, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Re: Next Meeting?

by Stephen C. Daukas

Not to trigger a full blown debate... It doesn't matter what point *we* are at, it matters what point anyone who decides to show up is at. It also doesn't matter what can fit on a flash drive... You have to ask yourself who the intended audience is. If it is techies who already know what a home directory is and might end up playing with Linux without WLUG's help, then it doesn't matter what you show, or if you demo more than one thing. If, however, you are trying to interest newbies who might decide to stay with what they already have if the alternative is perceived as a lot of work, then I would advise skipping the discussion about how cool the technology is and focus on why a standard Linux distro is useful. As I keep reminding my students - the technology is meaningless, the important questions to ask is "what can you do with it". If you really want to excite a lot of students, show them how they can save money and, more importantly time, and still turn their assignments in on time in a format acceptable to their professors! The reason for my initial comment in this thread was simple: In my experience at WPI, a non-trivial minority of students do not have a tremendous amount of experience with computers - even the self professed "programmers." Students new to WPI are already overwhelmed with some 30-40 hours a week of school work outside of class time. If they are "into computers" then they are already interested enough to invest their time based on the "technology is cool" camp. If, however, they are interested in technology as a tool, they will look at the demo, size up how much effort is involved (and that includes how readily available the necessary information is and how easy that info is to use), decide how helpful the venue is to trying Linux, assess if Linux/WLUG/whatever is worth it to them, and make a decision. If, as you say, the commercial distributions are no more difficult to install than windows, then that is what we should be showing, as well as OpenOffice, Mozilla, and so forth. Steve Matt Higgins wrote: >My 2 cents or less if you will. > >I think Knoppix is the way to go! The point is to showoff Linux-wares not to >teach about a particular distributions configuration mechanism or file system >layout. Knoppix is clean and impressive in many ways and does a great job at >showing off what Linux can do. Furthermore we are to the point were a Linux >install is no more difficult then a Windows install, particularly the commercial >distributions; Red Hat, SuSe, Mandrake, Yellow Dog, etc... > >So thats my 2 cents or less, long live Slackware! > >Matt > >Quoting Steve Freitag <Steve.Freitag(a)alum.wpi.edu>: > > > >>I've recently spent a small amount of time playing around with both the SuSe >>8.2 Live Eval, and Knoppix 7-26-03, so I thought I'd pass along my >>observation >> >> >> >>Both default you into KDE and have a similar selection of apps (Like >>OpenOffice, Mozilla, the GIMP etc). Knoppix happens to be based of Debian. >> >> >> >>There were a couple of things I liked about Knoppix. The first is that you >>don't have to go through all the YaST screens when you boot, Knoppix just >>boots right up to KDE and logs you on as user knoppix. The other neat thing >>about Knoppix is that you can save your configuration and home directory of >>the size you specify on a USB flash drive. With SuSE if you want to save >>your configuration/home dir it creates a 100MB file on your hard drive (and >>another 100MB for swap if you want). With Knoppix you can carry a cheap >>($10 after rebate) 64MB USB flash drive around with you and a Knoppix CD and >>boot a PC into your personal environment without touching the hard disk. >> >> >> >>-----Original Message----- >>From: wlug-admin(a)mail.wlug.org [mailto:wlug-admin@mail.wlug.org] On Behalf >>Of Stephen C. Daukas >>Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2003 4:23 PM >>To: wlug(a)mail.wlug.org >>Subject: Re: [Wlug] Re: Next Meeting? >> >> >> >>Is introducing yet-another-flavor-of-linux useful? I understand what you >>are trying to achieve, but one of the first questions that came to my mind >>was "what is the difference between Knoppix and a regular Linux distro"? >>(The first was actually "what the hell is Knopix"!) Will it be confusing to >>the people looking at is verusus what they see when they look at SuSe, Red >>Hat, etc.? >> >>Andy Stewart wrote: >> >> >> >>On Monday 01 September 2003 4:52 pm, albutler33(a)netscape.net wrote: >> >> >>Andy, >> >>I think a great topic especially for the new students would be "Fast Track >>to Linux" where you introduce the GNOME and KDE desktops and a few of your >>favorite tools and utilities. >> >>Al Butler >> >> >> >>HI Al, >> >>My most current thoughts are centered on Linux, its origins, the GPL, >>WLUG/WPILA, and then segue into single CD demo distributions for folks who >>want to "kick the tires", as it were, without fully committing their hard >>drives to Linux. >> >>One such single CD demo distribution is Knoppix, which does have KDE (and >>GNOME?). Once Knoppix is running, many things could be demonstrated. If I >>go with this idea, I'd want to have copies of the Knoppix CD available for >>people to take home, and hopefully they would try it at their leisure. >> >>How does that sound? Do people have additional ideas? Let's hear them! >>:-) >> >>Later, >> >>Andy >> >> >> >> >>__________________________________________________________________ >>McAfee VirusScan Online from the Netscape Network. >>Comprehensive protection for your entire computer. Get your free trial >>today! >>http://channels.netscape.com/ns/computing/mcafee/index.jsp?promo=393397 >> >>Get AOL Instant Messenger 5.1 free of charge. Download Now! >>http://aim.aol.com/aimnew/Aim/register.adp?promo=380455 >> >>_______________________________________________ >>Wlug mailing list >>Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org >>http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >>-- >>Stephen C. Daukas - stephen(a)daukas.com - http://daukas.com/ >> >> >> >> > > > > >_______________________________________________ >Wlug mailing list >Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org >http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > > > > -- Stephen C. Daukas - stephen(a)daukas.com - http://daukas.com/

Sept. 3, 2003

RE: [Wlug] Re: Next Meeting?

by Karl Hiramoto

USB flash drives now are in sizes from 16MB, 32MB, 64MB, 128MB, 256MB, 512MB, 1GB AND 2GB. They sell them online and as places like BestBuy, circit city, and most places with electroinics. They are replacing floppies for removable storage. Whith all this talk about Knoppix i'm downloading the ISO now :) On Wed, 3 Sep 2003, John Stoffel wrote: > > Steve> There were a couple of things I liked about Knoppix. The first > Steve> is that you don't have to go through all the YaST screens when > Steve> you boot, Knoppix just boots right up to KDE and logs you on as > Steve> user knoppix. The other neat thing about Knoppix is that you > Steve> can save your configuration and home directory of the size you > Steve> specify on a USB flash drive. With SuSE if you want to save > Steve> your configuration/home dir it creates a 100MB file on your > Steve> hard drive (and another 100MB for swap if you want). With > Steve> Knoppix you can carry a cheap ($10 after rebate) 64MB USB flash > Steve> drive around with you and a Knoppix CD and boot a PC into your > Steve> personal environment without touching the hard disk. > > So where did you find this flash drive? It sounds like a great way to > have Linux available when you don't want to screw with someones > computer! And what sizes do they have supported? > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > -- ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø Karl Hiramoto <karl(a)hiramoto.org> Work: 978-425-2090 ext 25 Cell: 508-517-4819 http://karl.hiramoto.org/ AOL IM ID = KarlH420 Yahoo_IM = karl_hiramoto ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø "There is hopeful symbolism in the fact that flags do not wave in a vacuum." --Arthur C. Clarke

Sept. 3, 2003

RE: [Wlug] Re: Next Meeting?

by John Stoffel

Steve> There were a couple of things I liked about Knoppix. The first Steve> is that you don't have to go through all the YaST screens when Steve> you boot, Knoppix just boots right up to KDE and logs you on as Steve> user knoppix. The other neat thing about Knoppix is that you Steve> can save your configuration and home directory of the size you Steve> specify on a USB flash drive. With SuSE if you want to save Steve> your configuration/home dir it creates a 100MB file on your Steve> hard drive (and another 100MB for swap if you want). With Steve> Knoppix you can carry a cheap ($10 after rebate) 64MB USB flash Steve> drive around with you and a Knoppix CD and boot a PC into your Steve> personal environment without touching the hard disk. So where did you find this flash drive? It sounds like a great way to have Linux available when you don't want to screw with someones computer! And what sizes do they have supported?

Sept. 3, 2003

RE: [Wlug] Re: Next Meeting?

by Matt Higgins

My 2 cents or less if you will. I think Knoppix is the way to go! The point is to showoff Linux-wares not to teach about a particular distributions configuration mechanism or file system layout. Knoppix is clean and impressive in many ways and does a great job at showing off what Linux can do. Furthermore we are to the point were a Linux install is no more difficult then a Windows install, particularly the commercial distributions; Red Hat, SuSe, Mandrake, Yellow Dog, etc... So thats my 2 cents or less, long live Slackware! Matt Quoting Steve Freitag <Steve.Freitag(a)alum.wpi.edu>: > I've recently spent a small amount of time playing around with both the SuSe > 8.2 Live Eval, and Knoppix 7-26-03, so I thought I'd pass along my > observations. > > > > Both default you into KDE and have a similar selection of apps (Like > OpenOffice, Mozilla, the GIMP etc). Knoppix happens to be based of Debian. > > > > There were a couple of things I liked about Knoppix. The first is that you > don't have to go through all the YaST screens when you boot, Knoppix just > boots right up to KDE and logs you on as user knoppix. The other neat thing > about Knoppix is that you can save your configuration and home directory of > the size you specify on a USB flash drive. With SuSE if you want to save > your configuration/home dir it creates a 100MB file on your hard drive (and > another 100MB for swap if you want). With Knoppix you can carry a cheap > ($10 after rebate) 64MB USB flash drive around with you and a Knoppix CD and > boot a PC into your personal environment without touching the hard disk. > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: wlug-admin(a)mail.wlug.org [mailto:wlug-admin@mail.wlug.org] On Behalf > Of Stephen C. Daukas > Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2003 4:23 PM > To: wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > Subject: Re: [Wlug] Re: Next Meeting? > > > > Is introducing yet-another-flavor-of-linux useful? I understand what you > are trying to achieve, but one of the first questions that came to my mind > was "what is the difference between Knoppix and a regular Linux distro"? > (The first was actually "what the hell is Knopix"!) Will it be confusing to > the people looking at is verusus what they see when they look at SuSe, Red > Hat, etc.? > > Andy Stewart wrote: > > > > On Monday 01 September 2003 4:52 pm, albutler33(a)netscape.net wrote: > > > Andy, > > I think a great topic especially for the new students would be "Fast Track > to Linux" where you introduce the GNOME and KDE desktops and a few of your > favorite tools and utilities. > > Al Butler > > > > HI Al, > > My most current thoughts are centered on Linux, its origins, the GPL, > WLUG/WPILA, and then segue into single CD demo distributions for folks who > want to "kick the tires", as it were, without fully committing their hard > drives to Linux. > > One such single CD demo distribution is Knoppix, which does have KDE (and > GNOME?). Once Knoppix is running, many things could be demonstrated. If I > go with this idea, I'd want to have copies of the Knoppix CD available for > people to take home, and hopefully they would try it at their leisure. > > How does that sound? Do people have additional ideas? Let's hear them! > :-) > > Later, > > Andy > > > > > __________________________________________________________________ > McAfee VirusScan Online from the Netscape Network. > Comprehensive protection for your entire computer. Get your free trial > today! > http://channels.netscape.com/ns/computing/mcafee/index.jsp?promo=393397 > > Get AOL Instant Messenger 5.1 free of charge. Download Now! > http://aim.aol.com/aimnew/Aim/register.adp?promo=380455 > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > > > > > > > > > -- > Stephen C. Daukas - stephen(a)daukas.com - http://daukas.com/ > >

Sept. 3, 2003

RE: [Wlug] Re: Next Meeting?

by Steve Freitag

I've recently spent a small amount of time playing around with both the SuSe 8.2 Live Eval, and Knoppix 7-26-03, so I thought I'd pass along my observations. Both default you into KDE and have a similar selection of apps (Like OpenOffice, Mozilla, the GIMP etc). Knoppix happens to be based of Debian. There were a couple of things I liked about Knoppix. The first is that you don't have to go through all the YaST screens when you boot, Knoppix just boots right up to KDE and logs you on as user knoppix. The other neat thing about Knoppix is that you can save your configuration and home directory of the size you specify on a USB flash drive. With SuSE if you want to save your configuration/home dir it creates a 100MB file on your hard drive (and another 100MB for swap if you want). With Knoppix you can carry a cheap ($10 after rebate) 64MB USB flash drive around with you and a Knoppix CD and boot a PC into your personal environment without touching the hard disk. -----Original Message----- From: wlug-admin(a)mail.wlug.org [mailto:wlug-admin@mail.wlug.org] On Behalf Of Stephen C. Daukas Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2003 4:23 PM To: wlug(a)mail.wlug.org Subject: Re: [Wlug] Re: Next Meeting? Is introducing yet-another-flavor-of-linux useful? I understand what you are trying to achieve, but one of the first questions that came to my mind was "what is the difference between Knoppix and a regular Linux distro"? (The first was actually "what the hell is Knopix"!) Will it be confusing to the people looking at is verusus what they see when they look at SuSe, Red Hat, etc.? Andy Stewart wrote: On Monday 01 September 2003 4:52 pm, albutler33(a)netscape.net wrote: Andy, I think a great topic especially for the new students would be "Fast Track to Linux" where you introduce the GNOME and KDE desktops and a few of your favorite tools and utilities. Al Butler HI Al, My most current thoughts are centered on Linux, its origins, the GPL, WLUG/WPILA, and then segue into single CD demo distributions for folks who want to "kick the tires", as it were, without fully committing their hard drives to Linux. One such single CD demo distribution is Knoppix, which does have KDE (and GNOME?). Once Knoppix is running, many things could be demonstrated. If I go with this idea, I'd want to have copies of the Knoppix CD available for people to take home, and hopefully they would try it at their leisure. How does that sound? Do people have additional ideas? Let's hear them! :-) Later, Andy __________________________________________________________________ McAfee VirusScan Online from the Netscape Network. Comprehensive protection for your entire computer. Get your free trial today! http://channels.netscape.com/ns/computing/mcafee/index.jsp?promo=393397 Get AOL Instant Messenger 5.1 free of charge. Download Now! http://aim.aol.com/aimnew/Aim/register.adp?promo=380455 _______________________________________________ Wlug mailing list Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug -- Stephen C. Daukas - stephen(a)daukas.com - http://daukas.com/

Sept. 3, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Re: Next Meeting?

by Stephen C. Daukas

Hi Andy! Sounds good to me! I think that would be a better transition for anyone who ends up installing the real thing (so to speak). Steve Andy Stewart wrote: >On Tuesday 02 September 2003 4:22 pm, Stephen C. Daukas wrote: > > >>Is introducing yet-another-flavor-of-linux useful? I understand what >>you are trying to achieve, but one of the first questions that came to >>my mind was "what is the difference between Knoppix and a regular Linux >>distro"? (The first was actually "what the hell is Knopix"!) Will it >>be confusing to the people looking at is verusus what they see when they >>look at SuSe, Red Hat, etc.? >> >> > >Hi Steve, > >OK, point taken. What if I were to demo the SuSE Live Eval CD instead? It is >actually quite close to a fully installed SuSE distribution. > >Andy > > > -- Stephen C. Daukas - stephen(a)daukas.com - http://daukas.com/

Sept. 3, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Re: Next Meeting?

by Andy Stewart

On Tuesday 02 September 2003 4:22 pm, Stephen C. Daukas wrote: > Is introducing yet-another-flavor-of-linux useful? I understand what > you are trying to achieve, but one of the first questions that came to > my mind was "what is the difference between Knoppix and a regular Linux > distro"? (The first was actually "what the hell is Knopix"!) Will it > be confusing to the people looking at is verusus what they see when they > look at SuSe, Red Hat, etc.? Hi Steve, OK, point taken. What if I were to demo the SuSE Live Eval CD instead? It is actually quite close to a fully installed SuSE distribution. Andy -- Andy Stewart, Founder Worcester Linux Users' Group Worcester, MA USA http://www.wlug.org

Sept. 2, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Re: Next Meeting?

by Stephen C. Daukas

Is introducing yet-another-flavor-of-linux useful? I understand what you are trying to achieve, but one of the first questions that came to my mind was "what is the difference between Knoppix and a regular Linux distro"? (The first was actually "what the hell is Knopix"!) Will it be confusing to the people looking at is verusus what they see when they look at SuSe, Red Hat, etc.? Andy Stewart wrote: >On Monday 01 September 2003 4:52 pm, albutler33(a)netscape.net wrote: > > >>Andy, >> >>I think a great topic especially for the new students would be "Fast Track >>to Linux" where you introduce the GNOME and KDE desktops and a few of your >>favorite tools and utilities. >> >>Al Butler >> >> > >HI Al, > >My most current thoughts are centered on Linux, its origins, the GPL, >WLUG/WPILA, and then segue into single CD demo distributions for folks who >want to "kick the tires", as it were, without fully committing their hard >drives to Linux. > >One such single CD demo distribution is Knoppix, which does have KDE (and >GNOME?). Once Knoppix is running, many things could be demonstrated. If I >go with this idea, I'd want to have copies of the Knoppix CD available for >people to take home, and hopefully they would try it at their leisure. > >How does that sound? Do people have additional ideas? Let's hear them! :-) > >Later, > >Andy > > > > >>__________________________________________________________________ >>McAfee VirusScan Online from the Netscape Network. >>Comprehensive protection for your entire computer. Get your free trial >>today! >>http://channels.netscape.com/ns/computing/mcafee/index.jsp?promo=393397 >> >>Get AOL Instant Messenger 5.1 free of charge. Download Now! >>http://aim.aol.com/aimnew/Aim/register.adp?promo=380455 >> >>_______________________________________________ >>Wlug mailing list >>Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org >>http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug >> >> > > > -- Stephen C. Daukas - stephen(a)daukas.com - http://daukas.com/

Sept. 2, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Re: Next Meeting?

by Andy Stewart

On Wednesday 05 January 2000 11:09 pm, donald vitkus wrote: > > i agree since i get lost with linux > > HI Don, When you say that you get lost with Linux, to what precisely do you refer? I suspect you may be referring to the command line interface vs. the graphical interfaces like KDE and GNOME which bear many similarities to Windows. Later, Andy -- Andy Stewart, Founder Worcester Linux Users' Group Worcester, MA USA http://www.wlug.org

Sept. 2, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Re: Next Meeting?

by Andy Stewart

On Monday 01 September 2003 4:52 pm, albutler33(a)netscape.net wrote: > Andy, > > I think a great topic especially for the new students would be "Fast Track > to Linux" where you introduce the GNOME and KDE desktops and a few of your > favorite tools and utilities. > > Al Butler HI Al, My most current thoughts are centered on Linux, its origins, the GPL, WLUG/WPILA, and then segue into single CD demo distributions for folks who want to "kick the tires", as it were, without fully committing their hard drives to Linux. One such single CD demo distribution is Knoppix, which does have KDE (and GNOME?). Once Knoppix is running, many things could be demonstrated. If I go with this idea, I'd want to have copies of the Knoppix CD available for people to take home, and hopefully they would try it at their leisure. How does that sound? Do people have additional ideas? Let's hear them! :-) Later, Andy > > __________________________________________________________________ > McAfee VirusScan Online from the Netscape Network. > Comprehensive protection for your entire computer. Get your free trial > today! > http://channels.netscape.com/ns/computing/mcafee/index.jsp?promo=393397 > > Get AOL Instant Messenger 5.1 free of charge. Download Now! > http://aim.aol.com/aimnew/Aim/register.adp?promo=380455 > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug -- Andy Stewart, Founder Worcester Linux Users' Group Worcester, MA USA http://www.wlug.org

Sept. 2, 2003

Re: Next Meeting?

by albutler33＠netscape.net

Andy, I think a great topic especially for the new students would be "Fast Track to Linux" where you introduce the GNOME and KDE desktops and a few of your favorite tools and utilities. Al Butler __________________________________________________________________ McAfee VirusScan Online from the Netscape Network. Comprehensive protection for your entire computer. Get your free trial today! http://channels.netscape.com/ns/computing/mcafee/index.jsp?promo=393397 Get AOL Instant Messenger 5.1 free of charge. Download Now! http://aim.aol.com/aimnew/Aim/register.adp?promo=380455

Sept. 1, 2003

fun, scary...

by Mike Peckar

http://www.malevole.com/mv/misc/killerquiz/ Mike

Sept. 1, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Crypto filesystem

by Andy Stewart

On Sunday 31 August 2003 6:24 pm, Chuck Homic wrote: > Does anyone have experience with an encrypted filesystem? I have a > notebook with a good chunk of confidential data, and although I would be > really pissed off if I lost it ($$$), I'd be even more pissed off not > knowing that my personal and corporate data may or may not have been > found. I use an encrypted file system. Its called the Cryptographic File System (cfs). I think its an older program, but it works well for me. Here's a pointer to a white paper: http://www.crypto.com/papers/cfs.pdf You can download it from the author's ftp site: ftp://ftp.research.att.com/dist/mab Later, Andy -- Andy Stewart, Founder Worcester Linux Users' Group Worcester, MA USA http://www.wlug.org

Aug. 31, 2003

Crypto filesystem

by Chuck Homic

Does anyone have experience with an encrypted filesystem? I have a notebook with a good chunk of confidential data, and although I would be really pissed off if I lost it ($$$), I'd be even more pissed off not knowing that my personal and corporate data may or may not have been found. So if anyone knows the answers, I have some questions: 1. Is loop-aes the way to go? Sounds pretty simple and painless to me. 2. What's your opinion of the optimal security/CPU tradeoff? I have an 800ish MHz Crusoe. So, I'll play around and probably figure out the answers by myself, but if anyone can jumpstart me (such as "Don't use funkyfish128, because that can be easily exploited!") that would be appreciated. If anyone's interested, I'll report the results of my adventure when I know something. Thanks! -Chuck

Aug. 31, 2003

Re: [Wlug] Query regarding email applications...

by Stephen C. Daukas

The idea is to replicate everything the user currently uses. So, yes - addresses as well as email. Also, the school does not use an IMAP server, so we have to do something outside of the obvious. Most of these users are capable of getting into the technology and crafting something that works for them, but they have their lives to live and don't want to invest the time - essentially your typical technology end user. So, if I can show them something that is easy and doesn't take much effort, great! Otherwise, they'll keep doing what they already know how to do - Microsoft. mhughes(a)wpidalamar.com wrote: >you only want to move email? or addresses and everything else? If it's >only email the easiest thing to do is to set up an IMAP server. Then >connect to the imap server from your "source" client, copy your messages >to the server, log in to IMAP with your "destination" client and copy them >down. > >*OR* ... just always use an imap server and don't store your email on the >client. > >-Marc > >On Mon, 25 Aug 2003, Stephen C. Daukas wrote: > > > >>Hi all! >> >>I am currently using mozilla 1.3.1 and want to be able to move my email >>to other applications. I'd like to be able to move it to Netscape, >>Eudora, and yes, Outlook. The reason for this is to show my new >>department head why folks using different operating systems, say Linux, >>should be allowed to use different operating systems as well as >>different email applications. His only concern is "email compatibility". >> >>Now, once upon a time, it was really easy to move the files between >>Netscape and Eudora, for example. They both had simple files that >>contained the information (e.g., Eudora used to use .toc of the index, >>and .mbx for the actual email while Netscape use to use - well, I can't >>remember, but is was a similar flat file arrangement). >> >>So, I took a quick look at Eudora 5.1, and it looks like the familiar >>old setup. Mozilla 1.3.1 looks like it is using a database of some sort >>(.sdb?) and Netscape 7.1 looks, well, different from what I remember! >>In the good old days, I could figure this out in a few minutes and would >>have replicated my email across all of these apps! the last time I did >>this was about 3 years ago as a demonstration of the very same point. Sigh! >> >>So, I decided to see how the import capabilities look and, well, they >>don't play well, as far as I can tell. Outlook and Eudora have no idea >>about Mozilla, and it doesn't look like Netscape does either. >> >>The point to all this is the following question: >> >>I have a boss who is predisposed to setting up Linux for those in his >>department who are interested (he might be as well). He wants to be >>able to "import & export" between Outlook and whatever on whatever. Is >>there a way to show him that he can have his cake and eat it too, either >>by moving files, or by using more than one email application as an >>intermediary (e.g., Mozilla -> Outlook Express -> Eudora)? >> >>Steve >> >>-- >>Stephen C. Daukas - stephen(a)daukas.com - http://daukas.com/ >> >> >> >> >>_______________________________________________ >>Wlug mailing list >>Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org >>http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug >> >> >> >> >> > >_______________________________________________ >Wlug mailing list >Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org >http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > > > > -- Stephen C. Daukas - stephen(a)daukas.com - http://daukas.com/

Aug. 30, 2003

Re: [Wlug] ssh woes followup

by mhughes＠wpidalamar.com

nothing out of the ordinary. I'll get a disconnect message when I kill the scp process... but if I don't kill it, it just sits around for at least 1/2 hour. On Fri, 29 Aug 2003, Karl Hiramoto wrote: > > Is there anything showing up in /var/log/messages ? > > On Fri, 29 Aug 2003 mhughes(a)wpidalamar.com wrote: > > > > > > > On Thu, 28 Aug 2003, Matt Higgins wrote: > > > > > > It is possible you are running out of file descriptors. Running out of fd's > > > shows up in strange ways! Did you bounce ssh on both sides of the tunnel. More > > > importantly on the receiving end ;). Try running ssh/scp with the -v flag set, > > > it may give you some good info. Run tcpdump .. are you dropping a ton of > > > packets? Do a simple ping to see if there is packet loss? Do a ifconfig are > > > there a ton of errs on the interface you are leaving on/ receiving from? > > > > > > If you see you are dropping a lot of packets but there are no interface err's > > > you can encourage the person that admins the VPN to check it out! > > > > > > > > > Matt > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Wlug mailing list > > > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > > > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > > > > > > > > > > > > I tried bouncing ssh at both ends... even doing a kill of all the > > processes of both ssh and sshd at both ends. > > > > scp -v doesn't show any weirdness. > > > > Ping works well, there's not an abnormal amount of errors in ifconfig. > > > > Is the open file limit system wide, or user specific? Mine's set for > > 4096, I've tried killing off a bunch of rarely used services on both > > machines to get the file count down. > > > > Now... this morning I'm noticing I can scp from the remote machine to the > > local machine, but not the other way around. In other words, from the > > remote machine, this works: > > scp qaddonline hughesm(a)10.1.0.19: > > But copying it back doesn't. > > scp hughesm@10.1.0.19:qaddonline . > > > > (qaddonline is about a 2 meg file) > > > > Also... from the local machine, iI can pull things down > > scp hughesm@10.21.2.184:qaddonline . > > but not push things up > > scp qaddonline hughesm(a)10.21.2.184: > > > > This didn't work last night. > > > > I can also now send small files (I tried one less than 1k) fine. > > > > I'd also like to add there's 2 machines in the remote facility that both > > have identical behavior. So I'm thinking it's either the link or my local > > machine. > > > > I'm no tcpdump expert, and both these machines have a good deal of > > traffic. What's an easy way to see if packets are getting dropped? > > (yeah, I suck at tcpdump filters). > > > > Any other ideas on things to look for? > > -Marc > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wlug mailing list > > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > > > -- > > ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø > Karl Hiramoto <karl(a)hiramoto.org> > Work: 978-425-2090 ext 25 > Cell: 508-517-4819 > http://karl.hiramoto.org/ > AOL IM ID = KarlH420 Yahoo_IM = karl_hiramoto > ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø > > To iterate is human, to recurse, divine. > -- Robert Heller > > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > >

Aug. 29, 2003