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Re: [Wlug] problems with email to hotmail.com

by Chuck Homic

On Tue, Apr 30, 2002 at 02:32:30PM -0400, Bill Mills-Curran wrote: > It's only hotmail that's the issue. I am sending lots of my email to > multiple recipients, and it's only hotmail that's complaining. And, > note that the mail gets to the hotmail servers, because it is the > hotmail agents that are informing me of the failed delivery. I assume by "complaining" and "informing" you mean a bounce message. Why don't you share the bounce? It might give us half a clue. -Chuck

April 30, 2002

Re: [Wlug] problems with email to hotmail.com

by Theo Van Dinter

On Tue, Apr 30, 2002 at 02:32:30PM -0400, Bill Mills-Curran wrote: > It's only hotmail that's the issue. I am sending lots of my email to > multiple recipients, and it's only hotmail that's complaining. And, > note that the mail gets to the hotmail servers, because it is the > hotmail agents that are informing me of the failed delivery. > > Thus, I don't think it's Charter that's the real bad player. (Note > that I can get the mail delivered if I use the Charter web email > client.) I think it's an issue of hotmail not liking the delivery > path from my linux box hiding behind a firewall. What's the bounce message look like? I thought you were having problems sending them mail, meaning you were getting "mail hasn't been delivered for 4 hours, continuing for 5 days" type issue. Getting bounces involves a completely different set of problems. -- Randomly Generated Tagline: "Bread has been proven to absorb water. Since the human body is more than 90 percent water, it follows that eating bread could lead to your body being taken over by this absorptive food product, turning you into a soggy, gooey bread-pudding person." - http://www.geoffmetcalf.com/bread.html

April 30, 2002

Re: [Wlug] problems with email to hotmail.com

by Bill Mills-Curran

On Tue, 30 Apr 2002, Chuck Homic wrote: > Date: Tue, 30 Apr 2002 14:41:44 -0400 > From: Chuck Homic <chuck(a)vvisions.com> > Reply-To: wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > To: wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > Subject: Re: [Wlug] problems with email to hotmail.com > > On Tue, Apr 30, 2002 at 02:32:30PM -0400, Bill Mills-Curran wrote: > > It's only hotmail that's the issue. I am sending lots of my email to > > multiple recipients, and it's only hotmail that's complaining. And, > > note that the mail gets to the hotmail servers, because it is the > > hotmail agents that are informing me of the failed delivery. > > I've had a similar problem a couple years ago with sending mail to Juno. > It sent me a bounce that complained I wasn't an MX. So I had to start > using RCN's cr4ppy-a55 SMTP server, which was down every other day and > waited 2 hours before relaying my mail. :( > > -Chuck > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > Chuck, I suspected the same, but changing pine to use the Charter smtp server directly didn't help. Bill

April 30, 2002

Re: [Wlug] problems with email to hotmail.com

by Chuck Homic

On Tue, Apr 30, 2002 at 02:32:30PM -0400, Bill Mills-Curran wrote: > It's only hotmail that's the issue. I am sending lots of my email to > multiple recipients, and it's only hotmail that's complaining. And, > note that the mail gets to the hotmail servers, because it is the > hotmail agents that are informing me of the failed delivery. I've had a similar problem a couple years ago with sending mail to Juno. It sent me a bounce that complained I wasn't an MX. So I had to start using RCN's cr4ppy-a55 SMTP server, which was down every other day and waited 2 hours before relaying my mail. :( -Chuck

April 30, 2002

Re: [Wlug] problems with email to hotmail.com

by Bill Mills-Curran

On Tue, 30 Apr 2002, Gregory Avedissian wrote: > Date: Tue, 30 Apr 2002 14:26:10 -0400 > From: Gregory Avedissian <avedis(a)ma.ultranet.com> > Reply-To: wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > To: wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > Subject: Re: [Wlug] problems with email to hotmail.com > > > > > > Theo, > > > > I don't think connectivity is the issue -- I'm getting through to > > hotmail, they are just refusing to deliver. I can try to send to one > > of the "good" servers directly and see what happens. > > > > Thanks, > > Bill > > > > Maybe this is a dumb question, but have you tried checking your Charter > smtp for mail right before you try sending from hotmail? I had a similar > problem recently with a web-based mail account. The ISP makes you check > mail before they'll send, to make sure that you're not hacking their > mail server. > > Greg Greg, It's only hotmail that's the issue. I am sending lots of my email to multiple recipients, and it's only hotmail that's complaining. And, note that the mail gets to the hotmail servers, because it is the hotmail agents that are informing me of the failed delivery. Thus, I don't think it's Charter that's the real bad player. (Note that I can get the mail delivered if I use the Charter web email client.) I think it's an issue of hotmail not liking the delivery path from my linux box hiding behind a firewall. Bill

April 30, 2002

Re: [Wlug] problems with email to hotmail.com

by Gregory Avedissian

> > Theo, > > I don't think connectivity is the issue -- I'm getting through to > hotmail, they are just refusing to deliver. I can try to send to one > of the "good" servers directly and see what happens. > > Thanks, > Bill > > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > > Maybe this is a dumb question, but have you tried checking your Charter smtp for mail right before you try sending from hotmail? I had a similar problem recently with a web-based mail account. The ISP makes you check mail before they'll send, to make sure that you're not hacking their mail server. Greg

April 30, 2002

Re: problems with email to hotmail.com

by mike＠beakerware.net

> If you see a similar response to the telnet as I have above, you should > be able to connect to hotmail just fine. Since 11 of their 14 hosts > aren't responding, and all of the MX levels are the same (5), there > may be an issue there. I know that you get a round-robin effect with > the hosts, but I don't remember if it's single-attempt round robin (ie: > try mx11, ok it failed, wait a little bit, then try mx11 again), if it's > a single-attempt with lookups in between (ie: try mx11, ok it failed, > wait a little bit, do a lookup and try the returned host round-robin > again (so you may or may not get the same host again)), or if it's a > multiple-attempt round robin (ie: try mx11, ok it failed, try mx12, > ok it failed, continue until one succeeds.) I believe that's left up to the implementation of the MTA. I'm using Courier, which tends to be more strict on following RFCs, and in the case of an MX record w/ a IP address (not compliant with an RFC) bails rather than look to the next, even if it is at the same MX priority. -mike

April 30, 2002

Re: [Wlug] problems with email to hotmail.com

by Bill Mills-Curran

On Tue, 30 Apr 2002, Theo Van Dinter wrote: > Date: Tue, 30 Apr 2002 12:28:36 -0400 > From: Theo Van Dinter <felicity(a)kluge.net> > Reply-To: wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > To: wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > Subject: Re: [Wlug] problems with email to hotmail.com > > On Tue, Apr 30, 2002 at 12:10:08PM -0400, Bill Mills-Curran wrote: > > I suspect that the problem is that I'm behind a linksys router using > > private IP's and NAT. I've tried talking to Charter tech support, but > > they are worthless -- they just tell me that they only support Outlook > > email. > > > > I've tried configuring Pine so the it uses the Charter smtp server > > directly, but that doesn't seem to help, either. Right now, I'm using > > my local machine, and routing through Charter. > > > > Any ideas? > > Well, there's 2 possible issues. 1) it's likely that they block your > outgoing directly to hotmail's mail servers. 2) most of the hotmail > mail servers seem to be down or rejecting connections for me (via DSL), > so they may just be having problems. > > You can check out if you can connect directly via: > > $ dig hotmail.com mx +short > 5 mx11.hotmail.com. > 5 mx12.hotmail.com. > 5 mx13.hotmail.com. > 5 mx14.hotmail.com. > 5 mx15.hotmail.com. > 5 mx01.hotmail.com. > 5 mx02.hotmail.com. > 5 mx04.hotmail.com. > 5 mx05.hotmail.com. > 5 mx06.hotmail.com. > 5 mx07.hotmail.com. > 5 mx08.hotmail.com. > 5 mx09.hotmail.com. > 5 mx10.hotmail.com. > > > $ telnet mx05.hotmail.com 25 > Trying 64.4.56.199... > telnet: connect to address 64.4.56.199: Connection refused > Trying 65.54.254.145... > Connected to mx05.hotmail.com. > Escape character is '^]'. > 220 hotmail.com Microsoft ESMTP MAIL Service, Version: 5.0.2195.4905 ready at Tue, 30 Apr 2002 09:17:54 -0700 > quit > 221 2.0.0 hotmail.com Service closing transmission channel > Connection closed by foreign host. > > > (I could only connect to 5, 9, and 13 of all of these 14 hosts...) > > If you see a similar response to the telnet as I have above, you should > be able to connect to hotmail just fine. Since 11 of their 14 hosts > aren't responding, and all of the MX levels are the same (5), there > may be an issue there. I know that you get a round-robin effect with > the hosts, but I don't remember if it's single-attempt round robin (ie: > try mx11, ok it failed, wait a little bit, then try mx11 again), if it's > a single-attempt with lookups in between (ie: try mx11, ok it failed, > wait a little bit, do a lookup and try the returned host round-robin > again (so you may or may not get the same host again)), or if it's a > multiple-attempt round robin (ie: try mx11, ok it failed, try mx12, > ok it failed, continue until one succeeds.) > > > -- > Randomly Generated Tagline: > Hee, hee! I can be a jerk and no one can stop me! > > -- Homer Simpson > Itchy & Scratchy Land > _______________________________________________ > Wlug mailing list > Wlug(a)mail.wlug.org > http://mail.wlug.org/mailman/listinfo/wlug > Theo, I don't think connectivity is the issue -- I'm getting through to hotmail, they are just refusing to deliver. I can try to send to one of the "good" servers directly and see what happens. Thanks, Bill

April 30, 2002

Re: [Wlug] problems with email to hotmail.com

by Theo Van Dinter

On Tue, Apr 30, 2002 at 12:10:08PM -0400, Bill Mills-Curran wrote: > I suspect that the problem is that I'm behind a linksys router using > private IP's and NAT. I've tried talking to Charter tech support, but > they are worthless -- they just tell me that they only support Outlook > email. > > I've tried configuring Pine so the it uses the Charter smtp server > directly, but that doesn't seem to help, either. Right now, I'm using > my local machine, and routing through Charter. > > Any ideas? Well, there's 2 possible issues. 1) it's likely that they block your outgoing directly to hotmail's mail servers. 2) most of the hotmail mail servers seem to be down or rejecting connections for me (via DSL), so they may just be having problems. You can check out if you can connect directly via: $ dig hotmail.com mx +short 5 mx11.hotmail.com. 5 mx12.hotmail.com. 5 mx13.hotmail.com. 5 mx14.hotmail.com. 5 mx15.hotmail.com. 5 mx01.hotmail.com. 5 mx02.hotmail.com. 5 mx04.hotmail.com. 5 mx05.hotmail.com. 5 mx06.hotmail.com. 5 mx07.hotmail.com. 5 mx08.hotmail.com. 5 mx09.hotmail.com. 5 mx10.hotmail.com. $ telnet mx05.hotmail.com 25 Trying 64.4.56.199... telnet: connect to address 64.4.56.199: Connection refused Trying 65.54.254.145... Connected to mx05.hotmail.com. Escape character is '^]'. 220 hotmail.com Microsoft ESMTP MAIL Service, Version: 5.0.2195.4905 ready at Tue, 30 Apr 2002 09:17:54 -0700 quit 221 2.0.0 hotmail.com Service closing transmission channel Connection closed by foreign host. (I could only connect to 5, 9, and 13 of all of these 14 hosts...) If you see a similar response to the telnet as I have above, you should be able to connect to hotmail just fine. Since 11 of their 14 hosts aren't responding, and all of the MX levels are the same (5), there may be an issue there. I know that you get a round-robin effect with the hosts, but I don't remember if it's single-attempt round robin (ie: try mx11, ok it failed, wait a little bit, then try mx11 again), if it's a single-attempt with lookups in between (ie: try mx11, ok it failed, wait a little bit, do a lookup and try the returned host round-robin again (so you may or may not get the same host again)), or if it's a multiple-attempt round robin (ie: try mx11, ok it failed, try mx12, ok it failed, continue until one succeeds.) -- Randomly Generated Tagline: Hee, hee! I can be a jerk and no one can stop me! -- Homer Simpson Itchy & Scratchy Land

April 30, 2002

problems with email to hotmail.com

by Bill Mills-Curran

I'm a Charter user, and something has changed between charter and hotmail so that I can no longer send email to hotmail.com accounts. I CAN send if I use Charter's web mail interface, but I much prefer to stick with pine. I suspect that the problem is that I'm behind a linksys router using private IP's and NAT. I've tried talking to Charter tech support, but they are worthless -- they just tell me that they only support Outlook email. I've tried configuring Pine so the it uses the Charter smtp server directly, but that doesn't seem to help, either. Right now, I'm using my local machine, and routing through Charter. Any ideas? TIA, Bill

April 30, 2002